Open Dialog with MAC Users

[Amphibious]

Aaarrrrrrrggghhhh!!! OK, since being introduced to computers in about 1980, I've run out of patience with my 8th, 9th, or 10th PC clone. I've truely lost count of how many "new" models/brands I've bought over the last 28 years. It well could be more than 10 but, that's not what matters today.

A couple of days ago my current PC, a Sony VAIO (not that brand or model makes any difference), a nasty virus invadid the machine. Norton didn't have a clue, did nothing about it, because it couldn't detect it. Talking to a computer geek friend, he suggested down loading a "free" virus detector and seeing if that would find anything. Did that with the exception, it wasn't "free". It searched my machine from their site, found 1,956 "detections" but when I clicked "clean" it wanted me to pay $39.95 for the download. Being totally frustrated and not able to do normal things on my computer without waiting 5 to 10 minutes for "things" to clear, I bought. I ran the program and isolated the buggers. Still no fix! Better, but the offender was still present. It's trait was to change my opening "home" page to their website which, "ironicaly" was selling spam, virus and personal protection software. You had to buy their program so that, I guess, they could "clean" your computer of THEIR virus crap!!!

After using the new program for several days, and getting various new "detections" every time, NORTON woke up and found the bast@#* virus. I think it was called a Trojan something or other. When Norten displayed the find I quickly had them destroy it. That's why I can't remember the exact name.

Now my computer is better but still running at a snails pace. It's three years old (yes, ancient, i know), running at 2.8ghz, 1 gb of Ram and 100 gb hard drive so, it shouldn't be slow.

OK, what would you MAC lovers say to me but, more important is telling me WHY. Don't give me one word answers like, BUY A MAC!

I want to know why. I'm seriously considering a purchase.

Reefbaby, I know you will have a lot to say and I look forward to speaking to you about this. I know there are others so, have at it.

Dick

[R. Deschain]

I've had a MAC for around 5 years. Since I'm not a computer type, and see my computer more of a household appliance rather than a toy or hobby, I wanted a MAC because, basically you turn it on AND IT WORKS!. There is no, or at least very little tinkering that I have to do. Everything is very integrated and programs tend to work well together. It was a hard decision to switch, but I'm so glad that I did. As far as techinical computer geeky reasons to switch, I'll leave that to someone else...

Good luck

[suep]

I understand your frustration, I pretty geeky and I spend several hours a week keeping my PC clean and safe. I am now VERY reluctantly setting up an email PC for the office and I've seriously considered a Mac for that.

If you decide to stay with a PC, I can suggest ways to help keep it clean. (I do know a lot about that subject. ) I'm not a Mac expert and I do know that they can be infected as well, it's just a lot less common so the odds are in your favor.

[lReef lKeeper]

Dick, if you decide to stay with a PC, i highly recommend the free anti virus dowlaod for avast! antivirus.

Free antivirus - avast! 4 Home Edition Download

[Stevej72]

Apple - Get a Mac

Changing from a PC (pice of crap) to a MAC was the best thing I ever did.
they just work seamlessly with almost everything.

MAC: plug it in. turn it on and its there. and it works

PC: Install 1 hr. setup 1 hr. frustration 6 hr. wait for a Vista patch 3 months...............

[IAreef]

I have used both systems for years, nearly any type of program that you can run on windows you can you can find and equivalent for on Mac. The nice thing about todays intel based mac's is that you can "dual boot" both windows and Mac OS on the same machine so if there is that one windows program that you just have to have you can use it when need be but still have the security and piece of mind running mac os for day to day uses. With out knowing exactly what you intend to use it for its hard to give specific recommendations on which mac I would recommend however generally speaking for just general computing the imac is a good choice for the user not looking for lots of horsepower on the desktop side, and the mac book on the notebook side, stay away from the macbook air IMO its just a status symbol and not suited to be a primary machine. If you are looking for a little more power or want to get into graphics, audio, or video editing the mac book pro's and mac pro desktops are what I would recommend you look at. All of this is just my opinion and I'm sure I left something out that someone else will fill in for me.


And welcome to the dark side

[CarmieJo]

Dick, I've never used a Mac so I can't help you there. But, I second Bobby's recommendation of Avast. There Home Edition is totally free and is a great product. My Avast caught a malware bug in a thread before anyone else's program got it.

[lReef lKeeper]

and mine caught it shortly after hers and i deleted the post that it was in and viola ... no more malware on the site.

[poppin_fresh]

I have 2 Windows machines and 2 Intel Macs at home. While I will be the first to admit that they BOTH have their pluses and minuses, I prefer my 20' Imac the best. Not only is the screen nice and big, but it takes virtually no desk space because its an all-in-one. I recently put Parallels and Windows XP on it so I can run Mac and Windows programs simultaneously...its really cool. I feel like this gives me the best of both worlds.

[R. Deschain]

thought it would be appropriate put my first post to TR from my new iPhone on this thread.

[rroselavy]

Aaarrrrrrrggghhhh!!! Now my computer is better but still running at a snails pace. It's three years old (yes, ancient, i know), running at 2.8ghz, 1 gb of Ram and 100 gb hard drive so, it shouldn't be slow.

As the System Admin motto goes: "The safest computer is the one that is shut off".

The Windows XP Pro workstations I have deployed at work have always been disconnected from the internet, only run our "Primary" applications (instead of being clogged with ancillary programs and personal files), run only required services, and only receive updates when necessary. With this effort, Windows has been very stable and virus free. I have very little to complain about in this regard...but I understand that this is not how you intend to run your personal computer.

We too have used Bootcamp to run Windows XP Pro on 5 iMacs and 4 Mac Pro's with very good success. I have only run into a problem using Wacom graphics tablets on Mac Pro towers running XP, but there could be other driver-run hardware devices that may also present a problem. YMMV.

OK, what would you MAC lovers say to me but, more important is telling me WHY. Don't give me one word answers like, BUY A MAC!

The problem that I have with Macs for professional use is how every user wishes to personalize their computer with their own music, photos, desktop images, and other mods. JUST GET TO WORK! This doesn't happen with our Windows XP boxes, which I think is a testament to the user-friendly Mac experience.

IMHO, the core behind the Mac experience for personal use is the seamless integration of the numerous Apple-branded applications, including Safari, Mail, iCal, iChat, Address Book, iPhoto, iTunes, iWeb, iMovie, iDVD - all included with a Mac purchase. These are "smart" apps that are to some extent interconnected, knowing how to find, import, sync data from one app to another, from an app to a iPod/iPhone, or from a digital camera to the Mac with hardly any effort. Devices are usually automagically recognized and the appropriate iLife app boots (if desired) to interface with the device. I do not have to install questionable drivers or 3rd party applications just to use my electronic devices.

Drag-and drop support on the Mac tends to be far more extensive and fluid than Windows, which makes the user experience more fluid.

The Apple branded templates (called "themes") in some of the iApps (like iDVD and iWeb) are a bit much for my taste, but Apple has gotten better at letting the user save out themes of their own. I tend to strip away all the toy-like eye-candy that I can to get to something clean and basic. Then I save out my theme or create a project file as a template.

The core behind Mac OS X is UNIX, which is a love of mine. The average user doesn't even know it, but underneath Apple's Finder and the Aqua interface is a robust, modern operating system as reliable as Linux. For power users, scripting, programming with Xcode and compiling open source software is all free, which is really cool.

Apart from USB - Firewire, Wireless, Bluetooth, and CD&DVD burning are all standard on most consumer models. There are no devices, cards, adapters, or drivers to install. Since all of these are included, you know the reliability is (most likely) less buggy.

Lastly, and not of least importance, is the product engineering behind the Macintosh. Apple takes a very smart, modular approach (where possible), and chooses expensive materials by which to produce their computers, and every generation gets even better. Macs are more expensive, but you are really getting a better built machine. When I open an Xserve, iMac, or Mac Pro, or even just install memory in a Mac Book, I am always noticing small, but really smart aspects of the design that make repairs and installations a breeze, and a level of finish inside that is superior to any PC I have worked with. I have sliced my fingers installing memory in a few PC computers in my day, so I really have to hand it to Apple in this regard. Apple could shave off a couple hundred dollars on their computers if they cheaped-out with materials or integrity; Fortunately for us who love the platform - they don't...and it shows on both the inside and outside.

The typical arguments I get from PC users is about cost and software availability. These are two real issues, but you have to calculate the risks of ubiquity (in the form of viruses and malware), and add to that the genuinely better Mac user experience and engineering. I would second the notion that "what you can do on a PC, you can also do on a Mac - sometimes better, or with more ease."; feel free to PM me your list of software concerns and I may be able to offer some solutions.

The Mac is not perfect. Like many computers, we sometime experience slow downs having to do with low memory, processor overload, memory leaks or hardware defects. These things sometimes happen. Add to that iDVD's somewhat finicky taste in recordable media compatibility, Safari's lack of support for Microsoft's Web extensions, Mac laptops not waking up from sleep in a timely manner when jolted before sleep engages, and a few others. A relatively short list to be sure.

If you plunge, feel free to post or PM with any questions about any Mac models or purchasing options.

-Scott

[Amphibious]

I've had a MAC for around 5 years. Since I'm not a computer type, and see my computer more of a household appliance rather than a toy or hobby, I wanted a MAC because, basically you turn it on AND IT WORKS!. There is no, or at least very little tinkering that I have to do. Everything is very integrated and programs tend to work well together. It was a hard decision to switch, but I'm so glad that I did. As far as techinical computer geeky reasons to switch, I'll leave that to someone else... Good luck

Thank you Psychojam. I've heard that from several Mac users over the years. That is definitely a plus.

I understand your frustration, I pretty geeky and I spend several hours a week keeping my PC clean and safe. I am now VERY reluctantly setting up an email PC for the office and I've seriously considered a Mac for that.

If you decide to stay with a PC, I can suggest ways to help keep it clean. (I do know a lot about that subject. ) I'm not a Mac expert and I do know that they can be infected as well, it's just a lot less common so the odds are in your favor.

Thanks for your input Sue. I've also heard macs are less vulnerable to viruses. Today a Mac store owner explained why. PC programing is based on DOS and Macs are based on Unix apparently much harder to hack. Can't say I understood but, it seemed logical.

Dick, if you decide to stay with a PC, i highly recommend the free anti virus dowlaod for avast! antivirus.

Thanks Bobby. I downloaded it and now running three virus detecting software. It's interesting to note, I can run one which finds things, run the second and it finds a few more, then run the third and it will find a couple more. That indicates to me how difficult it is to keep virus detecting software up to date.

Changing from a PC (pice of crap) to a MAC was the best thing I ever did.
they just work seamlessly with almost everything.

MAC: plug it in. turn it on and its there. and it works

PC: Install 1 hr. setup 1 hr. frustration 6 hr. wait for a Vista patch 3 months...............

Thanks Steve. Never heard that one before (PC = piece of crap) but, beginning to believe it.

I have used both systems for years, nearly any type of program that you can run on windows you can you can find and equivalent for on Mac. The nice thing about todays intel based mac's is that you can "dual boot" both windows and Mac OS on the same machine so if there is that one windows program that you just have to have you can use it when need be but still have the security and piece of mind running mac os for day to day uses...

If you are looking for a little more power or want to get into graphics, audio, or video editing the mac book pro's and mac pro desktops are what I would recommend you look at.

And welcome to the dark side

My primary purpose is to build and service my e-tail website. My wife and I also take 1000s of photos that we keep on our PC. I've now heard here and from others that I can probably run my web program, MS Frontpage 2003. I also believe MAC has a web building program. May switch to that. I'm leaning toward a MAC Pro but will look at the MAC Book Pro as I like portability as well. Thanks for your insight.

Thanks Carmie and Bobbie for your recommendation on Avast spyware. Got it. Use it daily, now.

I have 2 Windows machines and 2 Intel Macs at home. While I will be the first to admit that they BOTH have their pluses and minuses, I prefer my 20' Imac the best. Not only is the screen nice and big, but it takes virtually no desk space because its an all-in-one. I recently put Parallels and Windows XP on it so I can run Mac and Windows programs simultaneously...its really cool. I feel like this gives me the best of both worlds.

You are a man of excesses aren't you poppin_fresh. I have a lot to learn but I'm leaning heavy toward this switch. I'll be the "Old Dog" that has to learn some new tricks.

thought it would be appropriate put my first post to TR from my new iPhone on this thread.

All this new iStuff leaves me iConfused. Thanks!

Thanks again to everyone that responded. I really appreciate your input. I've talked to several former PC now MAC pundits and believe I can make the move. I have some remaining issues like PRICE. Man they don't give MACs away nor does it look like anyone discounts them. Anybody got a suggestion on where to purchase one?

Dick

[Amphibious]

Scott,

Your response was just what I was looking for. I know how much time goes into a long, insightful post. I've been accused of being a bit windy here on TR myself. But, sometimes the most useful information is in the details. I personally like details. I'm not going to quote you because it's right above and all of it is useful. I've read it twice already and will read it again, I'm sure.

I will PM you if I have problems with the learning curve. I've never taken a computer course and learned what I know by digging in and doing. I've pretty much made the decision to go with this MAC thing. Now need to go to the retail outlet and sit down at one, play a bit and ask questions.

Thanks, my friend.

Dick

[lReef lKeeper]

Thanks Bobby. I downloaded it and now running three virus detecting software. It's interesting to note, I can run one which finds things, run the second and it finds a few more, then run the third and it will find a couple more. That indicates to me how difficult it is to keep virus detecting software up to date.



Thanks Carmie and Bobbie for your recommendation on Avast spyware. Got it. Use it daily, now.

Dick

Dick, you may have found your own problem there. running multiple antivirus programs can make them compete against each other and cause issues between them. just a little something i learned from Mr. Phurst on the phone one day, i think.

[Amphibious]

I wasn't running three antivirus programs until a couple of days ago when Norton failed to detect the one that got me into this mess. I will keep that in mind though. Thanks.

Dick

[Amphibious]

Well, it's done!!! I went to an Apple re-seller and he talked himself right out of a sale. WHAT??? Yes, it's true. I was about to whip out the plastic when he said, "Have you checked the Apple web site for refurbished iMacs?". I didn't know of such a place so, he went there on the store machine and here's what I found and bought.

A Refurbished, iMac.
Display - 24" Glossy Widescreen TFT Active Matrix 1920 x 1200 pixels, millions of colors.
Processor - 2.8 Ghz Intel Core 2 Extreme.
L2 Cache - 4MB Shared.
System bus - 800MHz.
Video - Built-in iSight, mini DVI output port with support for DVI, VGA, S-video and composite video connections.
Optical Drive - Slot-loading Super Drive 8x, with 4x double layer burning(DVD+R,DL/DVD+RW/CD-RW).
Graphics - ATI Radeon HD 2600 PRO with 256MB of GDDR3 memory.
FireWire - One FireWire 400 and one FireWire 800 port, 7 watts each.
USB - 5 USB ports.
Memory - 2GB 667MHz DDR2 SDRAM - 2x1GB.
Hard Drive - 500GB Serial ATA.
Ethernet - Built-in 10/100/1000BASE-T (Gigabit).
Wireless - Built-in AirPort Extreme (802.11n), Built-in Bluetooth 2.0+EDR(Enhanced Data Rate) module.
Operating System - Mac OS X v10.5 Leopard.
Hardware Accessories - Apple Keyboard, Apple Mighty Mouse, Apple Remote, IR receiver.
Software - Cover Flow, Quick Look, Stacks, Time Machine, Mail, iChat, Safari, Spaces, iLife '08 Suite, Front Row, Photo Booth plus 30 day trials of iWork '08 and MS Office 2004 for Mac.
Included - install/restore DVDs, printed and electronic documentation.
Warranty - One year standard new machine warranty.

If that isn't enough there was a foot note at the bottom of my receipt indicating that other software may be included depending on availability.

The machine listed at $2399, I got it for $1599 with free shipping. Thank you Apple!!!

Now, iMac lovers, please decipher the above. I know very little about what I bought except, it's a screamer! HELP!

Dick

[lReef lKeeper]

nice buy Dick !! im sure Rob will have all kinds of stuff for you to download for it !! lol

another MAC owner ... thats ALL we needed around here. dont make me get my stick out !!

[suep]

Dump MS Office, unless you really REALLY need it. Open Office should do everything most people need, and it's free! And I strongly suspect it's more secure, if nothing else because it's not (yet) a target for the bad guys.

www: OpenOffice.org - The Free and Open Productivity Suite

[CarmieJo]

I love Open Office! I started using it a year or so ago after MS would not allow me to put Office on my new computer because they said I have loaded it to too many machines. The tech support guy who had English as a second language could not understand that my old computer had crashed and burned and i could not uninstall it there. I REFUSE to buy anything MS again. The only thing I miss is syncing Outlook to my PocketPC based PDA. Recently I have found a sync program between GoogleCalendar and PPC but I still miss having all the other Outlook things.

[Amphibious]

I can hardly wait for it to get here. I just tracked it and it left Sacramento, CA this morning at 4 am. I'm really excited. I've had many PC MS based machines and each time a got a new one, I was hopeful it would last more than2/3 years before going totally out of date or crashing.

The iMac at the dealer was 20". I haven't seen a 24" screen yet. It's got to be eye poppin fantastic!

Dick

[rroselavy]

The iMac at the dealer was 20". I haven't seen a 24" screen yet. It's got to be eye poppin fantastic!

Congrats Dick, it sounds like you got the top'o'line iMac. Super Schweet! Our line producer has one of these at work, and I can attest that the screen is big and beautiful. I am not a big fan of Apple's 23" displays, which seemed to be fraught with problems, but the 24" is a different animal.

I almost bought the 24" iMac recently, but the screen height does not fit into our "home office" furniture, so I was forced to settle with the 20".

2 GB of RAM is respectable too; Apple is finally putting more than just a nominal amount of memory into their computers. You should be all set with that.

500 GB of hard disk space is very roomy for all those photos you have...but like with any computer...don't forget to back up that data! Apple makes this easy with their Time Machine feature. Just add an external (usb or firewire) 500 GB hard drive and the OS will ask you if you want to make it a Time Machine backup destination. Select yes and the OS will do the rest, backing up your files as you work. Alternatively, you can manually backup/burn photos to 4.7 GB DVD media, but that could get tedious if you have tons of data.

FWIW, you may consider getting the extended warrantee from Apple for years 2 and 3 of ownership. Sure it costs $169, but if you have a problem with your display, logic board, hard drive, etc... you have some recourse after that first year. I've had Macs that have run rock solid since I purchased them, some that had problems in the first year, and a few (not many) that have given up the ghost in year 2 or 3. I see it like insurance (@ $85/year), and always purchase it for work machines, and most always for personal machines..especially for laptops.

Some people will download/install Firefox web browser instead of using Safari. I find that Safari renders pages a bit faster, and generally seems more responsive, but that Firefox is more compatible with the multitude of Microsoft permutations of Web standards. So, I generally use Safari for web browsing, but open and use Firefox when Safari is having problems with rendering a page...which isn't too often.

Anyhow, have fun with iPhoto and let me know what you think of iWeb!

[rroselavy]

Graphics - ATI Radeon HD 2600 PRO with 256MB of GDDR3 memory.

Oh, and yeah... this decent graphics card will accelerate iPhoto when displaying/zooming in and out of photos. This will make working in iPhoto that much more responsive and fluid.

[suep]

Carmie - there's not a lot I can add to your story. That's a very large reason I'm moving to open source/free software whenever possible. I don't mind paying for something but I very much mind jumping thru their hoops and trying to prove that I'm honest every time something goes wrong.


Rose - I second the vote for Firefox. I use it whenever possible on the PCs and I use a lot of the add-ons as well. By the time I get done, my setup is a lot more secure and web pages are faster and a WHOLE lot less annoying...

[Amphibious]

I am getting really excited with all this new info.

Thanks Scott.

[Amphibious]

Awesome, is the only word I can think of that describes this machine. Plug and play describes the set-up except for the e-mail program. I can never get that right without calling my provider. Once he walked me through the settings it worked of course. The 24" screen is wonderful. There is a lot to learn but, I'm glad I made the jump.

I thought it only fitting that the first post from the Mac be to TR.

Dick