Corey's first salt water tank

[Coreyz]

Thank you Small Fry for encouraging to begin a tank journal here!
8-28-07
I have been into fresh water fish for 10 yrs. or so now. I have picked out a 125 gallon tank for $316 (6'X18''X24'') with nice stand, canopy, I dot it about two weeks ago. After getting it all set up after a month or two of stabilization I I will be looking for live coral and other used equipment such as protein skimmer, MH lights and fans, and other necessary equipment. I am trying to keep cost down as low as possible. Any advise would be much appreciated. Thank you for your help.
Then LMAS member Bobby directed me to talkingreef.com thanks Bobby!

8-31-07
I just got lucky and won an auction on ebay for a used 125 gallon aquarium with stand, canopy, and dual overflows. There is no lighting, no sump, no pump, no other plumbing other than what I see in the pics of two tubes coming out of the top going down the side into the stand. I got a great deal at $316.
eBay ... :IT&ih=001
A local lmas member has offered me a great deal on a AquaC EV-120 protien skimmer. Thank you for the help guys & gals. (Aqua C EV-120)
AquaC - Protein Skimmers!
I contacted the manufacture because I couldn't find out what size tank it would support. They replied back in like 15 min. "There's a bit of overlap here, and for a 125 gal., you could go with either the EV-120 or EV-180. The 120 would be adequate for a light to moderate bioload, or if you're keeping more hardy species. If you're going to stock heavily or keep anything sensitive, you'll probably want to go with the EV-180."
So now I am looking for a used sump enclosure (recommended size?), pump, water containers, RO tap water filter, total dissolved solids testing equip., and MH lamps - actincs and ballast, (250watt?).
I am not sure how many GPH ( I do now) the pump will need to be to support a modest to heavily stocked tank or anything sensitive. Not sure about live sand depth 2-4 inches OK? It is 24 '' high. I was looking at getting some Arag-Alive aragonite reef sand. Suggestions please?
I'm heading over to check out Aquatica tomorrow, I have read allot of good things about there store.

8-31-07
I just ran over to Aquatica during lunch. Wow talk about a neat store ! A gentleman there recommended around 190 lbs of sand to get 3-4 inches deep. So I am planning on getting five 30 lb. bags of Aragonite sand, two bags of Arag Alive 20 lb. bags, and a bucket of Red Sea salt. I was really amazed at the display tanks they had as well as the huge selections of great fish and frags. He recommended a Gen X GX4100 pump 1085 gph to push the EV-120 protein skimmer.
(turns out I am looking at other options further down in thread)

8-31-07
I just picked up three bags of 30 lb agranite agramax reef sand, very fine. Also two bags of Agra live sand 20 lbs each. I have a friend that had a bunch of extras he gave me a great deal on. I hear it might not be enough to get 4 inches. But I can stop by Aquatica if I need more. I hear I will probably get little baby white star fish from it, very cool ! I also got a bucket of 48 lb instant sea salt. Thank you for telling me that Todd can make me a sump set up, I didn't know that. I loved the set up he made for his displays. I plan on getting allot of frags and fish from Todd in the future. I really want to help support his business being a local owner rather than a national chain store.

9-1-07
I just got the tank home safely and set up. Tonight I am getting a 30 gallon tank (reverse photosynthesis set up) and a ten gallon tank (refugium) donated to me for
free from a friend. Ric I would like to find some used MH lamps and Actnid. I have heard allot of people use two 250 watt bulbs maybe one additional higher wattage, along with actnid for the blue shade. I have plenty of room under neath for the ballasts. I'm willing to buy new bulbs after getting the used ballast and other connections. I'm experienced with MH and HPS from gardening but not for aquatic uses. I started shopping online classifieds last night for them at Reef Central. Thanks for recommending that sight. I am ready to buy a 100 Gallon Per Day Reef 6 stage Reverse Osmosis + Clear (DI)De-Ionized filter + Needle valve Reef Water Filter System for $61.99 plus $38 shipping. It is new condition retails for $559? Just wanted to check and see if this would be ok. I plan on ordering it by the end of the night, unless someone recommends other wise. I hope to pick up my protein skimmer as soon as possible from a local LMAS member who offered me a great deal on a EV-120. So this afternoon I am going to read up on building a proper reverse photosynthesis set up for the 30 gallon tank my freind is giving me this evening. Also a 10 gallon refugium.
What do I want to put in it? Well lots of coral. I plan to get about 140 lbs of dead coral, another 40 lbs of live coral to seed the dead coral while the tank is cycling. I would like to get a mated pair of clown fish, and some blue tangs for my boys they love Nemo. (probably not going to be first fish due to territorial issues) Also I would like to get some clams which I have been reading about require very bright lighting. But all of that will come later down the road. I am working hard to get everything going to begin cycling the tank. Once I have started that I plan to lay off of the spending frenzy for a while and let the tank stabilize.

9-1-07
Ok thanks to a local LMAS member, tomorrow I am picking up a EV-120 protein skimmer to get me started I'll upgrade it later on down the road. Also the first portion of my lighting set up. I'm going to wait until next Wednesday to order the RO/DI unit.
1 dual 250 watt PFO MH ballast
2 DIY reflectors
2 Sockets
2 PFO chords
2 10k XM bulbs ( 2 months life left )
Thanks for the tip on the water RO/DI unit Ellisz ! I plan on researching it more this evening. Thanks for all of the advise and support.

9-1-07
I was just wiping out the dust on the tank and stand. I discovered a scratch, or a hairline fracture at the bottom of the tank in the back right corner. It is currently 10 inches long. It is a tempered glass bottom. It is about 3/4 of an inch thick. I assume if it were a crack and it was old, there would be signs of algae growth with in it. There is none. So it could either be a scratch, or it could be a new hairline fracture which occurred during transportation today. It was resting on allot of foam. So now I guess I should go get some fish tank sealant, seal off that area, and let it cure before adding any water in the future. I am also concerned about having 180 lbs. or so of rock on it in the future. Any thoughts?
(Just thinking 125 gallons of water = 1042.5 lbs. + 200 lbs sand + 180 lbs rock, on ten inch possible crack Puppy Dog Eyes )

9-1-07
Yes when I run my fingers across it I can feel it from the top. Then I moved the tank and felt it from the bottom, hmm couldn't feel anything. So I madly scratched at it and it came off ! Confirmed silly silicon string! OMG ROFL !!! Whew ! Thank you Bobby LOL

9-2-07
I picked up my two MH 250's ,dual ballast, and Aqua C EV-120 protein skimmer today from Jasonm. I accidentally over paid him $20. He called me up about 30 min latter and let me know ! Thank you Jasonm! I discovered some Podcasts to day, free to download from Itunes, about reef tanks. One is called "Talking Reef". I have learned a bunch today listening to these great shows on my Ipod in my car as we drove all over the place today.

9-5-07
I'm sorry to say I made a mistake. I have been reading 4-6 hrs per night and listening to pod casts 6-10 hrs per day trying to get a jump start before I get RO/DI water in my tank. :-) After wiping down the tank, I put in 90 lbs of agranite agramax reef sand, very fine. Then.. I made the mistake. I put in a 5 gallon bucket full (on top of 90 lbs. great agranite agramax dead reef sand) from the previous tank owner. I began to notice towards the bottom it was damp (Ewww). Since then I have read an listened that this is a huge mistake. I guess I should have ran "the bucket of nightmares" under a garden hose for 3 hrs., then rinsed with RO/DI water. then waiting until tank was ready for damp substrate. So.... confession said should I remove all sand from tank and boil/rinse. Or will 2 months cycling through protein skimmer, refugium, and sump pump be enough to get this ready for a good dose of 75% dead coral %25 live coral for seeding? I don't know if it would be to soon , I know the live coral would be of benefit for filtration. Yet I hesitate for fear of putting live rock in to soon. Also there are shells and chunks of dead coral. Should I boil this and add back, to the future tank? (It looks like I have to take it out anyways to have over flows drilled) I have two bags on stand by for water flow, of Agra live sand 20 lbs each. I think I should get 3 to 5 more to shoot for a 4 inch layer across the entire tank as a minimum. ( Got some more the other day)

[Coreyz]

9-5-07
I went to Aquatica again today for a bit. Todd is building me a custom sump/refugium. I hope to get it in about 4 weeks or so. Picked up a nice water heater and more sand. Now I just have to decide on what pump to get to shoot for 1,250 gph on a five foot raise. I've saw a movie last night about closed loop systems for increasing flow rate, very cool.

9-5-07
Todd from Aquatica said I will probably have a ruff time with my dual overflows on the side of my tank.... He said I could get a hold of Matt Nay on here. (LMAS) I need to talk to him about some other options involving drilling out holes for bulk heads on the side of my tank. Matt drop me a line when you can please. (He did, he's got the hook up)

9-8-07
May I ask for some advice on picking out a pump? I have heard that there maybe issues with to high of water temperature. So far I have two MH 250's, and that's allot of heat. ( I plan on getting Actinic lights in the next month or so) They will be in an enclosed canopy, with dual 4.5'' fans as intakes on the right, and the sames for exhaust on the left. I can modify the size of the intakes and exhaust later on down the road if need be. After doing allot of shopping for external and internal pumps I can see there is a huge price difference between the two. May I ask what other members have had success with in the past for a 125 gallon tank, shooting for 1,250 GPH on a 5 foot raise to achieve around 10 cycles per hour.
http://www.marinedepot.com/ps_ViewItem~ ... P2280.html
http://www.bestnest.com/bestnest/RTProd ... =PON-02728
http://www.championlighting.com/product ... ctid=18058
I was seriously considering Bobby's Mag 18 internal pump. But I wasn't sure with the combo of my lights and an internal pump would create water temp issues. I just really want to avoid having an in line chiller expense later on down the road. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thank you for your advise.

This is all a ruff draft copy and paste. I will try to edit it some later tonight if I can. I have read where other members have had difficulty editing an old post. So if I can not I appologize for typos.

Thanks,
Corey Z.

[Small Fry]

WOW thats alot of reading lol. But i got through it

make sure to post some pics soon (its easiest to host them from photobucket), just to show em what ur made of

Cant wait to see more, Welcome to TR

[CarmieJo]

Hi Corey and to TR.

It sounds like you have a good start. You want to add your LR right at the beginning. That is what is really going to seed your sand and truly make it live. I highly doubt that you will get micro stars from the packaged "live sand" in a bag. There may be some bacteria in the bag but it has been sitting on the shelf for who knows how long and I really don't think that there is all that much life in this product. To get some diversity, if you have a friend with a tank just get a cup or 2 of sand from their tank.

[lReef lKeeper]

welcome to TR Corey, glad to have you aboard. there is a GREAT wealth of knowledge around here. just remember this ... only bad things happen fast in this hobby (CarmieJo quote) lol. if you ever have any doubts give us a shout. there is a lot more activity here than there is on the LMAS forum, which will result in faster responses and more responses.

[Coreyz]

Tank, canopy, and stand.

MH lights.

Old overflows, I hope I can drill my tank once properly identified.

Aqua C EV-120 Protien skimmer

good sand on bottom "untreated bad sand" mistake on top, will be removed and treated. I got two new bags of dead sand on stand by with some bags of live sand on stand by.

[rayme07]

Hi Cory welcome to TR

What I did with the sand I went to LFS and bought some bags of dry sand and asked for some live rock rubble and when I got home I put my rock in, then the rubble on the bottom and the dry sand on top. In a Moth my dry sand was more alive than the live sand they sell in the stores. Also Nice Tank.

[Coreyz]

Yeah I have developed a good relationship with a guy at a LFS who said he would give me some big scoops out of there tanks, for a good jump start on seeding the sand. I have gotten to know him really well getting stuff for my old fresh water tank all the time. He offered without me even asking. And now that I have read more about it. (Thanks Rayme07!) I want to put egg crate along the bottom to keep the rock from coming into direst contact with the tank's bottom as well. I wont be investing in any more "premade bags of live sand". What I am concerned about is....I put in 90 lbs of agranite agramax reef sand, very fine. Then.. I made the mistake. I put in a 5 gallon bucket full (on top of 90 lbs.of great agranite agramax dead reef sand) from the previous tank owner. I began to notice towards the bottom it was damp (Ewww) The previus tank owners bucket of sand I believe will have harmful bacteria that will hamper the cycling of the tank. There was red algae on the side of the bucket towards the bottom. It has dried out over the last week. Yet I think I should take it all out and run it in a sterile trash can with a garden hose for a few hours maybe? Also should I break it down into little batches and boil it to make sure none of that nasty read stuff is still alive? then a light rinse with RO/DI. Then after that and I am done with any and all mods to the tank, add it back in. Then add all of the unopened bags remaining when I am ready for the first batch of leak test RO/DI water to be added. It will probably be quite a while.... I still have to identify my tank to decide if the sides can be drilled for 2 over flows and a return. I know for sure the bottom can not. I also need to spend allot of time researching the closed loop and the number of pumps and there placement with in the plumbing and create a diagram of how it will all be planned out. I plan on taking my time on that.

[Coreyz]

So here is my idea of keeping things simple with just one main pump, if it can be done? A Mag 18 mounted externally from the sump area, sending the return water through a closed loop before returning to the display tank. I don't plan on using UV. I only plan on using one 150W heater in the sump, the MH lights will assist with heating the water. I think with multiple control valves the water flow could be adjusted to what ever in necessary depending on the point through out the system. I am shooting for 1250 GPH on the main 125 display tank from a 1,800 GPH pump on a 5 ft rise. Then adjusting to maybe as little as 100GPH going through the refugium? With a bypass in the sump design to keep up with the rest of the higher rate water flow over the heater? Not sure yet...


Here is another example someone else created.

[Small Fry]

Sump design looks nice and clean, but IMHO, leave out the filter sock and sponges. Over time, even if you clean them religously, particles will still get stuck and decompose, causing fluctuations in your tank you cant help. As long as yoyu have a good skimmer and a good fuge, your fine.

On that note, your fuge is very very important. I have chaeto in mine and i find that all the particles that flow through it get stuck, and all the pods and bristleworms find it and consume it. As well, fuges add much life to your tank, that allow you to have a heavier load of healthy corals and fish.

[Coreyz]

Yeah I complete agree small fry; I definitely don't want a micro filter sock no way... lol That thing would need to be cleaned every 5 min. lol forget that. I definitely want the particulate to be flowing into and out of the refugium area. (Although I do plan on setting it up to where I could put one on for a while, just in case the situation arises that I may need one temporarily) I love to watch that area. I just put up that second picture as an example of water flow out side of the sump area, (not for the inside) that someone else illustrated. My sump is being custom made by a local pro. So I am leaving the inside up to his knowledge and experience. I just got back from going over there to check on it.

[Seahorsedreams]

Socks are great to leave on for a day or so after a really good water change and scrubbing.

Can't wait to see how your tank shapes!

[Coreyz]

I'm trying to properly identify my tank for my professional glass cutter friend. It is 72'' long 23'' high 18 1/2 '' deep. I got a list from my LFS and it is very close to one that is 125 gallon yet 72 1/2 '' long 23 3/8 '' high 18 1/2'' deep. My tank has a white rectangular sticker on the bottom facing up with red text saying tempered bottom do not drill. No other forms of identification for model nomenclature. I would like to determine if the side glass panels are tempered glass or not. So it can be drilled out to install bulkheads for over flows. My friend has been experimenting with cutting teeth into glass overflows too, sounds pretty neat. Any suggestions for matching up my measurements to the proper manufacturer and model number would be greatly appreciated.

[Coreyz]

Oh... My... Goodness.... I got it. I have found the exact match to my measurements in "All-Glass Aquarium" catalog from my LFS !!! Now I shall report to my glass cutter friend for some nice bulk head drilling on the left side for some over flows, I'm hoping for two one inch holes on each back corner, four total. Plus additional returns, which he advised. I'm shooting for 1,250 GPH coming down with a turbo charged closed loop system finely tuned.

[Coreyz]

Well I spent the last couple of hours following links from google..... I see allot of people say the flow rate of a 1'' bulk head is going to be in the neighborhood of 500-600 GPH. So with four going out and four returning the flow I might be able to get around 2,000 GPH in theory. Taking into account the diameter of the pipe, the degree of angle of each bend, the raise, the depth of the placement of the bulk head, type of screen covering it, amount of water pressure in 24-20 inches of water, and other variables I think I might be able to get close to my target of 1,250 GPH hopefully. I have e-mailed the suspected manufacturer of my tank to see if there tanks have tempered sides or not.

[Coreyz]

I have heard that 8 holes sounds a little excessive. I'm a little concerned about making Swiss cheese out of my tank as well, lol. I plan to take my time and set it up a nice as I can before I get purified water into it. I'm debating on whether or not the tank should be drilled here in my apt. or not. I am concerned about the extreme noise which my be created and draw alot of attention and or concern. I was thinking about moving the tank to a remote location to be drilled. I'll talk more with my pro glass cutter friend about techniques I have thought/read about to dampen vibration and sound while drilling. I'm also concerned about if we do lose a pane of glass, how to be properly prepared for a worst case scenario in advanced. My tank has two center braces. So it looks like it might be a while, in the mean time I plan to do more research on how to reduce sound, vibration, and being prepared for the worst.

I have 4' 8 & 1/2'' of head to clear. I was planning on getting a mag 18 pump rated at 1,200 GPH @ 5' or 1,375 @ 4'.

[Coreyz]

Were going to put it face down and drill vertically on the back, 4 holes. Hopefully get it knocked out this Sunday.

[rayme07]

Good Luck and have fun.

[Coreyz]

Thanks Rayme, were going to need all the luck we can get ! Yet I a prepared to repair my tank, or buy a new one if anything goes wrong.

I picked up a nice 32 gallon Brute trash can today. With a dolly that locks into the bottom. It should be nice for my future RO/DI set up. I have a little pump that I haven't used for yrs. too. I'm going to run it over night with some white vinegar before I use it though.

[Coreyz]

My friend successfully drilled four 1 and 3/4 inch holes in my tank today for one inch bulk heads. Two for custom overflows on the way. and two for returns. It was smooth no cracks, because he's a pro!

I went to my first LMAS meeting tonight. I saw two 600 gallon marine tanks. Also about 18 other tanks around 55 - 100 gallons each at the President's house. The sharks ,puffers, seahorse, and everything was amazing ! I also won the first prize in the raffle. I got a Seachem Reef Status magnesium, carbonate, borate test kit. Also A bottle of Bio-Blen Marine food Herbivore diet. I saw a ice chest full of bags of frags. They were passing out little zip lock bags of Cheato for refugium's left and right with lil critters. The hosts were so very kind. It was and honor


My friend "Naykid" from LMAS drilling my tank today.


Awesome puffer!


There were two tanks of total 5 sharks!


One of two 600 gallon display tanks, the sumps added alot more than that!


Side view of 600 gallon. Notice the entire back is over flow, no little guys to jump over in this tank.

[Coreyz]

Sorry for exceeding the image limit here. I can post on another thread or do what ever it takes to help you with bandwidth. Just let me know how to properly proceed please. Thank you for your help.


This amazing cleaner shrimp had his own huge tank!











Please note; They are all large fish from larger display tanks. They are going to be quarantined and treated for up to ten weeks. Before returning to there main display tanks, after treatment is fully verified.

I have more pics of the back end plumbing, filtration, etc. yet I wanted to hold before getting permission to post any more pics on this specific thread. Or maybe links to pics hosted off site?

[Small Fry]

WOW, the tanks themselves arent that ap[pealing to me but the fish are absolutely stunning!!!!!!!!!!

I really want that naso tang, probably one of the nicest ifve ever seen!!!!!!!!!!!

ur lucky to have a club with members of that calibre!!!!!!!!

[CarmieJo]

Coryez, you can only add a limited number of pictures to each post but you can add as many as you want in a thread. I recommend resizing pictures to 600x800.

[Coreyz]

This is the new Sump/refugium I have been waiting for. It looked beautiful at first glance when I picked it up today. The workman ship is exquisite. You would be amazed at how straight and clean the cuts are, the rounded corners, Almost invisible sealant. Absolutely amazing. Yet when I got it home tonight and had a chance to study it in a more practical sense, I realized I needed a better education on this concept. All the others I have seen have the main intakes coming into the Protein Skimmer first. This is appears to have the intakes coming in on the opposite side of where the protein skimmer was intended to be placed, and the area will not fit the skimmer I told the designer I had. So the skimmer would be skimming the water just before it left to the sump pump which would be externally mounted to the one inch bulk head. The refugium is nicely designed in the middle, yet there is no by pass for faster water flow. I am shooting for 1,250 GPH, with as little as 100 GPH through the refugium. I wanted to get your much more educated opinion on the design of this before I go chop it all up to fit the skimmer in on what appears to be the opposite side all together backwards set up. Than you all for your advise.
I'm going to have to cut out the center front between the doors on the stand to get it to fit underneath.


Big skimmer little space on wrong end?

[Coreyz]

Ok I am such a newb.... Fortunately my son had a head ache at school this afternoon, so I picked him up and after a giant cookie and milk shake he was fine. So he got me out of work and I was able to go see the designer at the LFS. He was able to explain to me how to properly use his unique design to its maximum potential. He explained that I should run the skimmer in the middle large area. Then to the left with the egg crate is where the water will rush in go over the first most crucial baffle which will reduce the bubbles then into the area where skimmed water will also be flowing out of the Protein skimmer then flow to the right through the bubble reducing sponge ( for the first two months or so), to the final staging area where it calms and blends with the critters over flowing from the corner refugium then out through the bulk head to my externally mounted mag 18 sump pump. Then it headed back up to the display flowing partially through a T with a control valve to restrict the flow going into the refugium. He also recommend that I raise my skimmer, he offered to build me a stand if I wanted. as well as drill a bulk head on the baffle to the left of the skimmer, so it would empty into the area where the water first enters from the display, and use a small mag drive pump dedicated to just the skimmer with a flow control valve to adjust it to its optimal flow rate. Also having the refuigium in the corner will allow it to have double the water height of the rest of the sump the way the overflow is designed, and if I get a serious algae problem I can stop the flow to just the refugium (treat the problem) while maintaining flow through the rest of the sump. Which you would not be able to do with most traditional flow through designs. You would have to stop everything.He was a big help today, and would have been when I picked it up if I was not in such a hurry, and he didn't know I wasn't familiar enough.