Tang killing Perculas

**saltyreef** · 08-17-2007, 10:34 AM

I can't keep Percula clowns alive! When I first started in the hobby, trusting soul that I was, walked out of the LFS with a bleached BTA and 2 Percula clowns. The clowns last 3 days, the BTA was dead in a week.

Months later, I got the "white sebae" & 2 more percula clowns (all from same tank). After the first 2 days one clown was dead from a ripped off fin. The 2nd jumped out of the tank 2 days later and died. The sebae turned into 2 healthy BTAs.

Just before moving the anemone to the 30gallon, my daughter talked me into a Tomato clown (I had decided no more clown fish.) This clown hosted the anemone immediately & stayed alive! When I moved things to the 90g, I thought maybe this tank would be the charm for 2 Perculas. The Tomato went to the LFS & I came back with the 2 Perculas. Stupid mistake that I am now kicking myself over. The smaller one went MIA after a week & I thought the BTA ate it. I bought another one, the 2 clowns became friends right away, and a week later find the new one dead. The other one is not doing well. I did realize that the BTA didn't eat the clown. Now, I believe it is the Tang that is killing them.

The other night I walked around the corner and saw the Tang laying in the front sandbed. My first thought was "oh crap, the tang is dead." As I got closer to the tank, the Tang swam away and under it was the poor Percula getting squished into the sand/glass. I've also noticed that during the day, the Perculas didn't swim around & just hung out in one spot. At one point I was going to take one out thinking it was minutes from death, then couldn't finish the job, and let it go back in the 90. I turned the lights off and it is swimming like nothing is wrong. The Coral Beauty is also a key in this picture too, it also picks on the clowns, in tandem with the Tang (they were raised together in the 30g for 9-10 months.)
This has been so disappointing. I can't have Perculas, and am wondering if I should try again with a Tomato or Maroon? I was hoping with the 90 I could have
2 clowns that would host the BTA's.

**CarmieJo** · 08-17-2007, 09:53 PM

What kind of tang? My maroon is pretty pugnacious defensively. She will bite hard enough to draw blood if you get too close to the BTA.

**tim** · 08-17-2007, 11:20 PM

I bet a damn yellow tang.

**Russel P** · 08-18-2007, 09:04 AM

If the tang is responsible, my money's on a damn yellow too. But I don't think laying on top of fish is the preferred method of settling territorial disputes. At night, many fish do some strange things, like sleep on their sides. I've seen tangs attack, and they make big swoops and use their sharp parts near the caudal peduncle. It's an active, fast and furious attack, nothing like "laying atop a smaller fish and squishing it into the sand." Maybe I'm about to learn something new, but my guess is something less-exciting is going on here (water quality, weak clownfish, etc.).

**saltyreef** · 08-18-2007, 10:40 AM

The Tang is a Blue Hippo. I bought it just about a year ago, there is also a Coral Beauty Angel that I've had 2 months longer than the tang, and a Lawnmower Blenny that I've had for 8-9 months. The hippo does the attack, and big swoops method as well. The Coral Beauty postures over the clown. If the Percula tries to move 'up" in the tank, more than an inch or two above the sandbed, the Tang and/or Angel will swim over it, intimidating it back down to the sand bed, more so when feeding time comes around.

My water quality is good according to the tests and Xenia (xenia is my best indicator of when the water quality needs some attention & I trust them more than the test kits.) My RBTAs are thriving in this tank as well. They are getting all fat & bubbly & turning green to rose/l tan. In fact, all the corals are thriving and there are tiny pink coraline spots all over the back glass, so water can't be an issue. One thing I have changed is feeding, I still feed 2xdaily, but less than I did in the 30g. In fact, right now they are waiting for me to feed, and the Tang is herding the clown away from the "expected food stream."

I never would have thought it was the Tang! When I got it, it was smaller than a dime, thinner than paper and laying in the bottom of a 10g at the LFS. It was dying and my 30g was far better than where it was so I bought it, with the intention of giving it away (if it survived) when it outgrew the 30g. It formed a bond with the Juvi Tomato clown, rarely venturing far from it. That was a "food" issue more than anything else. It was cool with the Tomato so I figured it would be ok with the Perculas. Wrong call here!

This is a pic of the Tang coming out of a swoop down on the Percula. Swims too fast to get a better one when the Tang is physically touching the clown. My getting closer to the tank doesn't help either.

I am taking the Percula back to the LFS, I won't have any trouble catching it

I will think about getting more clowns & if I do it will be Maroons or Tomatos. With the Tang & Angel, I will need a more aggressive species of clowns.

**salt-rookie** · 08-18-2007, 10:56 AM

I do NOT believe it is the Hippo Tang! I have had trouble with Small clowns in the past couple of years (Tank Raised)...I've been wondering if they are being inbred in captivity and not out crossing to keep the genetics fresh. I've had good succes buying medium tank raised, I'm assuming they have made it past the critical age. I have also noticed that many mail order sites now consider small clowns as difficult shippers. They used to be VERY prolific!

If you all think Yellow Tangs are agressive, try a Purple and a Scopas! They make Yellows look very peaceful!

**saltyreef** · 08-18-2007, 11:55 AM

I could agree on the possibility of genetics issues salt-rookie. Get me on a soapbox when it comes to dog breeding and genetics. I've rescued over 100 dogs in the last 2 years & do some dog training/ behavior modification. I know how stupid people can be when they propagate animal life without thought to genetics. It could well be that the Tang & Angel are picking on this percula because they know something is not right that I can't see. I did not see them attack the two that died, just the one that is surviving. Could it be possible that it is a "carrier" of some disease & this is what killed the other two? There are no signs, ie white spots, etc. I have seen the Tang attack it ,and at night it swims around like nothing is wrong! Very strange & no more Perculas for me!

**CarmieJo** · 08-18-2007, 10:09 PM

When I worked at the OSU Vet Clinic back in the late 70's there was a guy that brought in a Standard Poodle. He wanted the clinic to collect semen for AI since the dog couldn't get a tie because he had a seizure every time he went to stud! How irresponsible is that??? OSU declined.

**Seahorsedreams** · 08-19-2007, 01:28 PM

Originally Posted by salt-rookie

If you all think Yellow Tangs are agressive, try a Purple and a Scopas! They make Yellows look very peaceful!

Scopas are FREAKS!

Do you keep getting the clowns from the same LFS (who probably gets them from the same supplier).

**saltyreef** · 08-19-2007, 09:38 PM

Originally Posted by Seahorsedreams

Scopas are FREAKS!

Do you keep getting the clowns from the same LFS (who probably gets them from the same supplier).

In the 90g, I've bought 3. The 3rd one came from a different LFS. I started my 30g back up a couple of weeks ago & it tested 0 ammonia, so I put the surviving perc in it yesterday & this morning it is doing ok. I am going to keep & watch it for a while. The Tang & Coral Beauty appear to be happy to have the tank to themselves. I'm going to hold off putting any more fish in the 90 for a couple of weeks to make sure there isn't a disease issue.