Let the cycling begin!

[Astrivian]

Here we gooooooo......... The beginning of cycling my hex for a FO marine tank. Oh, i was wrong about the size, i said 15, but it is more like 9. TY for the input about why not to cycle using damsels. I dig your points. Besides, with 20 lbs of live sand and 9 lbs of live rock, i think it will cycle okay without fish. It looks cluttered at the moment, i am trying to get the water to the right temp so i can hide the heater without knocking everything over. Incidentally, this is a TR tank! I am building it using advice from the forums and podcasts (so if it crashes...... just kidding) Well not everything is from the forums etc., i do know about some stuff already But TY for all the advice so far, all of you have been a great help.

Some details:

DSB of live sand about 5 inches deep
9 lbs of live rock (figi and the other stuff)
no skimmer yet, but i will get one (do you like the Midiflotors?)
no HOB filter (since it broke 1 week after i bought it )
50w heater
airator in the back, which i would like to use with a skimmer actually (will post about this later)
cannot do a refugium or sump, not enough room

Fish plans (all tank bred, i really don't dig on catching wild fish and stuffing them in a glass box):

Two clowns
Two or three small hermits
Two snails (the ones that burrow in the sand and pop out for feeding, i keep forgeting the name)

Lastly, i will not be purchasing fish until the first week of September; so this thing will have quite some time to cycle.

[PSH]

Most clown fish need a minimum of 30 gallons when full grown. One clown may be fine for a 9 gallon tank but 2 may push your bioload too high. Unless you have killer flow and a good skimmer and/or a huge sump. Here is a cool link to some great nano fish. http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/s...fm?pCatId=2124

[V]

hey astro, just another heads up in the oxygen exchange department! ur going to need the surface to be broken frequently!

hey Q, didn't one of the nano guys in your comp do a hex tank with the overflow spilling over the outer lip & into a catchment tank below? i never saw the final result, but he had a great idea there! & the thing was it didn't take up heaps of space!

[Astrivian]

Yes V, i forgot to mention that i was going to grab a powerhead for the tank as well and aim it up a bit to break the surface. PSH: i forgot female clowns got so big You have a point there about the gobies and blennies. But, thinking in terms of gobies instead of clowns, what is the max load for a 9 gal tank (pre-skimmer and post-skimmer)?

[RocketSeason]

Welcome to the hobby! (or should I say, welcome to the addiction.)

Max load for a 9 gallon would probibly be two fish. One Clown would be great, and a bottom dweller would work as well. Perhaps a shrimp golby and a pistol shrimp.

Any more than that would be too crowded I would think.

[gwen_o_lyn]

I would either get a pair of clowns (small) or one fish like a goby. The clowns will stick together and once they are hosting don't need much room, but that area the one clown is in will be one less spot for other fish to swim.

[Astrivian]

Hmm, interesting that the talk relates to room, i was concerned about bioload at first. My LFS has a good HOB venturi skimmer rated for 70 gallons that they use on their nano reef in the store. I am saving up for it, at $200 it is a bit beyond my reach right now.

I really like the yellow headed jawfish, and my sandbed should be deep enough at about 5 to 6 inches. Would that and a small clown, or maybe a small goby or firefish be okay do you think? Also, do you count snails and hermit crabs in the load?

Ty for all the suggestions. This is great info to be gathering during the cycling phase. As rob said in his "Selecting fish" cast, plan what you want to do before adding stuff.

[Astrivian]

Diatoms!! I have diatoms! We are on our way now! Watch out you master reefers the Astrivian is comming

[RocketSeason]

haha! great!

[Amphibious]

I really like the yellow headed jawfish, and my sandbed should be deep enough at about 5 to 6 inches. Would that and a small clown, or maybe a small goby or firefish be okay do you think? Also, do you count snails and hermit crabs in the load?

Ask yourself this question and answer it, too. Do hermits and snails poop? That's your answer to the question.

I personally would advise you to stay away from the Yellow headed Jaw fish. They need much more care and consideration than a DSB. They also are considered a touchy fish to keep.

[Astrivian]

PODS! I have pods!

One thing i detested about my office, which is turning out to be quite fun, is the total lack of windows. Today i turned out the lights in the room and just watched the glowing tank for a bit. And, behold there were amphipods! They are all over the glass. At first i thought they were just tiny air bubbles, but then i noticed they were moving against the current. After taking a much closer look, i could see they were more or less like tiny tiny rice-shaped critters.

Rob: I fully support your comment in episode 50 about being able to watch the tank mature. This is truely fun. Do i really need fish?

[CarmieJo]

Rob: I fully support your comment in episode 50 about being able to watch the tank mature. This is truely fun. Do i really need fish?

It took me a while to add fish but [IMAGINE THIS] I have found that I really enjoy them! Of course I still sit in front of the tank after lights out with my red headlight and spy on the night critters!

[Rob]

Rob: I fully support your comment in episode 50 about being able to watch the tank mature. This is truely fun. Do i really need fish?

fish??.. bah.. who needs fish...lol..

[Stevej72]

What are fish?

[CarmieJo]

Fins, scales, swim around but you can't frag them...

[Astrivian]

Well all, i got a new job as an instructional designer at a local community college. The good news: I will have way more money to fuel this new addiction. The bad news: i have to move the hex from my former office to my home. How should i do this? I am not transfering it to another tank, just moving the entire tank. So, i think i can leave the sand bed relativily intact in a bit of water. I can yank the LR and put it in a bucket. Actually, now that i have followed Amphibious' thread, i think i will give the PVC pipe in the DSB a shot. This makes a lot of sense Amp, espicially in my hex where i need to keep as much of the bed alive as possible (it is tall and narrow). Also, i think i will try to move the LR away from the sides of the tank. Again, TY Amp you make some excellent points regarding this.

Any suggestions?

[Amphibious]

now that i have followed Amphibious' thread, i think i will give the PVC pipe in the DSB a shot. This makes a lot of sense Amp, espicially in my hex where i need to keep as much of the bed alive as possible (it is tall and narrow). Also, i think i will try to move the LR away from the sides of the tank. Again, TY Amp you make some excellent points regarding this. Any suggestions?

Who, ME, have suggestions??? Of course I have suggestions. First, thanks for the compliment.

The obvious is, moving a tank takes preplanning and a dedicated amount of time. If you can't set up a tank at home first, even temporarily, then you gamble losing some of your livestock to a mini cycle. The reason is, every time you move LR and expose it to air you will experience a die off of stuff on the LR and that will trigger a cycle. It's possible to be successful and not lose anything but just want you to be aware ahead of time. Also, your LS is going to be disturbed and could experience a die off too, causing further problems in getting reestablished in a short period of time.

I'm not sure of the size of your tank but, wet sand is heavy and moving a tank with wet sand will put stress on the seams and possibly cause a leak. Use caution and get help to move the tank. Putting it on a piece of plywood bigger than the tank gives a more stable platform, easier to carry and ease in getting it into and out of a vehicle.

PVC pipe stands should be precut about 3/4" taller than the depth of LS. Cut more than you think you need just in case you need them when reassembling the LR. I used 2" pipe and drilled holes through the stands to allow water to flow through them. Gobies and other small critters will use them for hide-outs.

Save and use as much of the existing water as possible. Have new saltwater made up ahead of time in preparation to do water changes. If you don't already have one get a Rubbermaid Brute trash container for this purpose. Designate it for SW use only.

Test for Ammonia, NO2, NO3 and PH daily for a week. If you experience a rise in values do a water change. How much of a water change you will have to determine by the amounts of change in values. Continue testing until the tank is stable again.

Remember this - Good luck is not a mysterious element that springs itself upon hapless individuals bestowing good fortune to the unfortunate, but rather a predictable event given to those clear thinking individuals that plan ahead.

Since I've advised you to plan ahead, I can wish you good luck knowing you will have it.

Hope this helps. If you have further questions, just ask.

[Astrivian]

Wow Amphibious thanks for all the advice. The plywood idea is great, i will have to do that. Luckily, the tank is only 10 gallons with no livestock of any kind (other than pods!); however, your points are well taken. I have a 6 gallon bucket i use for SW as well as a smaller 10qt bucket for smaller water changes, acclimation, etc. I am thinking of using both for LR and water so i can keep as much of the original water as possible.

Also, thanks for mentioning about water changes. I did a water change a while ago and was a bit confused as to whether or not that was a good idea. Are you supposed to let ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate build during the cycling process so the bacteria and DSB can grow and flourish? Or, do you do a water change when the nitrates begin to rise?

Lastly, i thought i would post an updated image of the tank. The LR is better arranged now, with a piece of bleached coral on top (yea i know, a friend gave it to me a while ago and i didn't know what else to do with it). The brown coating over everything is diatoms and the macroalgae came with the LS.

With regards to what i am thinking for the new set up, i will definatly use the PVC pipe ideas to rest the LR on. Also, i am thinking of using a small masonry bit to drill some holes in the LR and using either hard airline tubing or small PVC in the holes to help hold them together (no glue) just so they wont topple on crabs or fish. I will watch the numbers closely for a couple of weeks until they all level out. At that point i might add a few more small pieces of LR in the hopes of finding some hitchhikers (like apstasia! oh boy! ).

Again thank you all so much for the help. I seriously could not be doing this with out TR!

[CarmieJo]

I like the pedestal look.

[Astrivian]

Ty Carmie. I am hoping the top bleached coral becomes covered in colorful coraline. Then it will look like a giant flower, and not like a coral skeleton.

[CarmieJo]

It will. I have a bunch of coral skeletons in my tank (from when I kept FO back in the 80's) and they are becoming encrusted and look quite nice in my opinion. My tank has been up for 8 months. This pix is really of my echinopora but the frag is perched on a dead coral head and you can see the pink and green coraline. Later, when the lights are on, I will take a better pix.

[colaebola]

I was wondering where that bleached coral went!

[Astrivian]

Of course i took your dead coral cola! I wasn't going to leave it to suffer in a infested tank.

Note: Colaebola is a friend of mine; i am not flaming him, just teasing him

[Astrivian]

So i got my first fish for the nano! It is an Arabian dottyback (Pseudochromis aldabraensis), about 2" long. It is a little timid, since it is the only one, and i will get a different small fish to help coax him out. I am thinking of a royal gramma (gramma loreto) for the next, and last, fish.

The Arab is pretty cool. Thank Amphibous for his suggestion to use the PVC pipes under the LR! The little bugger has already excavated around an entire pipe, and spends most of his time hiding under the base rock (the one supporting all the LR). It is a funny little dude. I heard it might eat snails, and i have seen him "peck" at them, but so far no snail casualities. I think it is more interested in my cat.

I am also sporting a small cleanup crew: 1 blue legged hermit, 1 red legged, and 2 friggin snails i can never remember the name of. They are conical, burrow in the sand, and pop out when you feed. Anyone know what i am talking about? I would know the name if i saw it.

Regarding the levels, ammonia and nitrite are still zero, while nitrate has risen to about 15 ppm from 5 ppm after 6 days. I will be doing a 10% water change here in the next day or so. My schedule allows me to do a 5% water change (1/2 gallon) twice a week. I think i will do this as my regular maintnence to help keep the conditions stable.

This pic is from wetwebmedia, i will post my own as soon as i can:

[CarmieJo]

Cerith snail? Or maybe Nassarious? The nassaroius are more blunt and have a snorkle that sticks up out of the sand when they are burried.