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Thread: Can you believe this advice from F & S

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    Grand Master Reefer CarmieJo's Avatar
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    Can you believe this advice from F & S

    Please take a minute and read the "More Information" tab on this page. http://www.fosterandsmithaquatics.co...2&pcatid=21432 I am OUTRAGED at such irresponsible advice from a supposedly reputable company! I am contacting them and making a complaint! Here is their email address. CustomerService@FosterandSmithAquati...thAquatics.com>;
    Last edited by CarmieJo; 07-05-2010 at 02:43 PM. Reason: Added email
    Carmie


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    Grand Master Reefer CarmieJo's Avatar
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    Here is a copy of my email and their response.
    Dear Carmalee,

    Thank you for contacting Drs. Foster and Smith. We apologize for any inconvenience as a result of these instructions. We have forwarded your e-mail to our Management team, and our Buyers, to let them know your feelings in this matter. Please let us know if we can be of any additional assistance.

    If we can be of additional assistance, please contact our Internet Customer Service Department at 1-800-381-7179, via email or on our Live Help link. Live Help is available 7:30 a.m. to 9:00 p.m. CST Monday through Friday and 7:30 a.m. to 7:00 p.m. CST weekends.

    Sincerely,

    Customer Care
    Drs. Foster & Smith
    Foster and Smith Aquatics
    jpk


    -----Original Message-----
    From: Carmalee Scarpitti
    Sent: Jul 5, 2010 2:00:59 PM
    Subject: You are offering bad advice!

    I happened to be reading the description of this sand
    http://www.fosterandsmithaquatics.co...2&pcatid=21432
    and
    looked at the "More Information" tab. I am OUTRAGED that a company as
    reputable as F&S who advertises "Authoritative Aquatic Advice" would offer
    advice like this:
    *General Use:*

    1. Put Instant Aquarium in the aquarium at the rate of around a pound per
    gallon.
    2. Add water to the aquarium making sure to place something on top of the
    substrate so as to not disturb the substrate.
    3. Turn on heaters and filtration.
    4. After the tank is stable (usually within 24 hours or less) add a few
    fish and begin feeding normally.
    5. Begin stocking with additional fish after a week or so.

    First of all it is irresponsible to recommend cycling a tank with live fish!
    This method went out with under gravel filters! There is no reason to put
    live animals through a cycle when dropping a pinch of fish food or a raw
    cocktail shrimp in the tank will do the same thing.

    Even if the method of cycling with live fish was current the advice to "add
    a few fish" is injudicious. Does this mean that someone can add 3 or 4 small
    tangs in a 12 or 14 gallon nano tank?

    Then there is the advice to add "additional fish after a week or so." What?
    Where is the advice to monitor the cycle? If nothing else, don't you want to
    sell test kits?

    If you want to offer advice please make sure it is good advice that will not
    drive people out of the hobby. I believe that bad advice is the number one
    reason why people fail in this hobby. If nothing else, as a business you
    should have a vested interest in keeping people in the hobby and buying the
    products you sell.


    Carmalee
    They were quick to respond but what in the world does "any inconvenience" mean? I will let you know if I hear anything back from their management team. If anyone else sends an email let me know what they say.
    Carmie


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    Master Reefer THEJRC's Avatar
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    Hrmm, they do mention their buyers. Based on prior reputation (good) I would give them the benefit of the doubt that they are filling out the more information sections with vendor provided information as many retailers their size would. The thing that bugs me there though is that looking at the products description on other sites as well as the Caribsea site I dont see the same mis-information. Give them a week or so to work things through "management" and then check and see if the description has changed.
    ~J


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    Apprentice techguy's Avatar
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    That's pretty surprising. I hope they are responsive in a meaningful way to your letter of concern. I will be watching this thread to hear what comes of it.
    "The ultimate test of man's conscience may be his willingness to sacrifice something today for future generations whose words of thanks will not be heard."

    ~ Gaylord Nelson

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    Grand Master Reefer CarmieJo's Avatar
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    I'll keep you all posted!
    Carmie


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    Assistant Moderator rayme07's Avatar
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    wow that is unbelievable, I sure hope they change their instructions and dont toss it over their shoulders.
    Ray or Raymond
    There is no elevator to success in marine tanks. You have to take the stairs.


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  7. #7
    Grand Master Reefer CarmieJo's Avatar
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    Well it has been a week and I haven't heard anything.
    Carmie


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    Grand Master Reefer Pat's Avatar
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    wow time to give them a call and more emails fr everyone
    in anticipation for my Miami trip this is my song of the week!!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDp5IP76PeY

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    Our Brotha Down Unda
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    haha.. gold. Its the silver bullet people that would be effected though, but dont worry, it matches the bad advice already experienced at the LFS..lol



    Vquilibrium Productions

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    Grand Master Reefer CarmieJo's Avatar
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    Yep, I guess that their buyers are really more of sellers.
    Carmie


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    Master Reefer boyesreef's Avatar
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    carmie, it looks like you got the basic sweep it under the rug and forget it email. there is no way it dosent mention the product in any way and got taken care of. they sell items, they dont bother researching. buyer beware. they are great for pricing, but take info with a grain of salt. i told oceanic of a major flaw in there bio-cube line, and they told me they were happy i purchased there product and glad i was happy with it. generic emails are the best, they dont have to pay people to read complaints all day.
    we are all on the long road to our dream tanks, im going slow and enjoying the journey!

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    Grand Master Reefer Seahorsedreams's Avatar
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    They won't change it Carmie, I've tried. They've had wrong IDs that REALLY make a difference and they have cold water fish listed as tropical... the description never changed and that was a LONG time ago.

    Same goes for Petsolutions.com. That had a pic of a Barberi lionfish but the name of the sphex. I wanted a sphex so I emailed them and got more pictures. It's a Barberi... no doubt. They said they would look into changing it but they never did....

    WRONG!
    Renee

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    Grand Master Reefer CarmieJo's Avatar
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    Yeah, I haven't heard anything back. Big surprise, huh?
    Carmie


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    Insightful Reefer mpcolson's Avatar
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    Smile

    This is the Carib-Sea Offical Directions for the Hawiian Black Arig-Alive Sand I put in my Tank I bought From Foster & Smith. I Used the Manufactuers Directions as I figured they knew how to use thier own product:

    Hawaiian Black Directions

    General Use: For best results, use at least 1 pound of AragAlive!™ per gallon of seawater. For deep sand beds use 2 pounds per gallon. Do not rinse. AragAlive!™ may also be used to seed CaribSea’s dry aragonite products. AragAlive!™ compresses new tank cycle time and suppresses initial ammonia spike. Live rocks and most invertebrates may be placed in aquarium immediately. However, gradually introduce fish within the first 3 weeks, and do not exceed one inch of fish per gallons of water during this time.
    Warning! Placing new substrates over the top of an established substrate bed can be damaging to aquatic life. Gently mix new material into the existing bed with fingers. For added safety, this process can be done in sections, over the course of a few days.


    Sometimes it's better for the reseller to simply reprint the manufacter's information to avoid spreading bad information.

    Just a thought....

    BTW... This sand looks good in the tank and is cycling away as we speak. Live Rock going in Monday. And if I have learned anything so far it's don't rush things!

    Another thing I read that I will remember forever.... Dillution is the secret to polution!

    Theres my 10 cents of wisdom.

    Be kind to your servers, they'll be kind to you!

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    Master Reefer boyesreef's Avatar
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    well, ive also been told that feeding a marine tank is not needed, especially in a reef tank, because the fish eat the algae off the rocks and the junk out of the sand. ive never been back into that store. same place that told me any fish can be either fresh or salt water fish as long as it is slowly introduced to the new salinity over a few weeks. i guess its time to slowly decrease the salt in my tank, im tired of keeping salinity just right.
    we are all on the long road to our dream tanks, im going slow and enjoying the journey!

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    Grand Master Reefer CarmieJo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boyesreef View Post
    well, ive also been told that feeding a marine tank is not needed, especially in a reef tank, because the fish eat the algae off the rocks and the junk out of the sand. ive never been back into that store. same place that told me any fish can be either fresh or salt water fish as long as it is slowly introduced to the new salinity over a few weeks. i guess its time to slowly decrease the salt in my tank, im tired of keeping salinity just right.
    You might want to reconsider!
    Carmie


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    Master Reefer boyesreef's Avatar
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    lol, i dunno carmie! it sounds like some solid science! the kid that told me was younger than me and doesnt even have goldfish at home and doesnt like fish. he must be right.
    we are all on the long road to our dream tanks, im going slow and enjoying the journey!

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    Assistant Moderator rayme07's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boyesreef View Post
    lol, i dunno carmie! it sounds like some solid science! the kid that told me was younger than me and doesnt even have goldfish at home and doesnt like fish. he must be right.
    That kid shouldn't even be working there!! What a shame that a LFS owner would put some kid that dont know crap about this hobbie in that store to sell stuff. I feel bad for the fish and corals.
    Ray or Raymond
    There is no elevator to success in marine tanks. You have to take the stairs.


    Raymond's 30 gallon tank
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    Master Reefer boyesreef's Avatar
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    i dont go back there, and i detour anyone away from it.
    we are all on the long road to our dream tanks, im going slow and enjoying the journey!

  21. The Following User Says Thank You to boyesreef For This Useful Post:

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