Craigslist 55

[PapaMcEuin]

Ok, so starting a new project. The nano after the strip out due to a culpera over run has turned into a frag farm. I have changed out the PC65W light to a local vendors selection of a dual 420NM light and the SPS on the frag rack in combination with a reorientation of my T5 Giesemann Powerchrome AquaBlue+ has really helped restore color and growth back. Had just some CurrentUSA dual white/atinic and was not really doing the job. So I now have gone through a round of 2 years experimenting with a relatively low cost setup, ya, relative.... Anyway, wanting to have a larger tank and have found a 55G and stand on Craigslist for $100 bucks. Will be going to pick it up Saturday. I will have to ditch the crushed coral base and clean it out, he was running it as a ciclid tank based on the statement of gear and fish he is selling as well. I will take it to a local tank builder here and have him drill it and build in overflows and returns and a sump. Two days ago I bought a RO unit, thought it was RODI but it is just a RO unit with 2 RO membranes. I am bidding on a dual DI add on right now. So I won't be doing water trips anymore which for a 55g and sump would be absolutely rediculous I think. Anyway, so I will likely not have the tank back for a few weeks which is fine with me. Need time to find some poor broke person desparate to sell their protien skimmer and other parts thus the Craigslist title to the project. Anyway, Will do some things differently this time. For one, I will buy a lighting grid to put down before I put down sand and not create pinch points to break the bottom glass. I think I will have him build the overflow right in the middle and have returns on the back corners to have a central rock stack and keep growth away from the sides. What are the thoughts on that? Also, will build a canopy my self. Have a few PC ballasts and end caps from and old setup that I will use in combination with some T5 lights. I will use the PC's for the 420NM and the T5's for the Giesemanns.

All that remains is the discussion with my wife on exactly where we are going to put it...

[rayme07]

Sounds awesome I cant wait to follow along!!

[CarmieJo]

That's great! I love a low cost project.

[PapaMcEuin]

Well, we have the tank home, it is in great shape. We had the option of 2 stands. A gloss black MDF stand that looked alright but worn and a nasty brown wood stand that needed work. I am not much for MDF and saltwater so we opted for the brown stand. I have taken off the doors, sanded it down, and done an ebony stain on it. That will dry tonight then likely do two coats of poly on it tomorrow. I have gloss black poly/stain but Courtney said she actually liked the look of the wood grain showing though a little so I may just do clear poly over it now and return the black gloss stain/poly stuff so it doesn't hide the wood grain any more. Found a guy locally that has a sump and overflow on craigslist, but have yet to get ahold of him yet. Hoping it is still available and he will sell cheap. Oh, and that it fits....

[PapaMcEuin]

Here are my pictures posted on Facebook. http://www.facebook.com/album.php?ai...0&l=7d499ed337

[PapaMcEuin]

Well, the tank is now at a local marine store, a guy that builds some mega tanks, small tanks, and many of the systems used by stores in the area. I decided on a sump that was 30" long by 10wide and 16high. 10 wide/deep is all the stand will accomodate. Funny thing is that no company manufactures a sump in this size or larger. The Eshopps unit that I have working with my 20 is the only unit that fits these standard sized stands. It just seems that they are ignoring a significant market. Anyway, he is fine with it. Will cost a lot more than what I paid for the small sump, but seems to be the only realistic solution. It will give me a good setup though. I have heard nothing but compliments of his work from people that have had him build systems for them. We did joke though about the drilling of the tank. I wanted to make sure that if the tank cracked, that i just needed to pay for the work on the tank and he did not start the sump yet. At this point, I can turn around and sell the stand after being refinished for as much as I bought it and the tank. Anway, he asked for a couple of weeks to finish the project which is fine with me. Gives me time to get in the parts I need for the rest of it. Oh, and hopefully sell the furniture we don't need and are clearing out to make room for the tank. We did decide it is going in the breakfast room and replacing a couple of junk cabinets.

[CarmieJo]

That will be a cheerful way to start your day!

[lReef lKeeper]

im guessing Todd is doing the work on the tank ??

we could have saved you a LOT of money with a little DIY ingenuity !! lol

[PapaMcEuin]

I am guessing Todd is the guy @ Aquatica. I always forget his name. Anyway, time is one thing I don't have much on. Since I am already working on refurbishing the stand and just started my next MBA class, Marketing, he will cost more, but save me lots in time. I will be building my hood as well so that is where I am budgeting the time towards. I may be picking up a Mag 5 pump off craigslist. I am just trying to decide if that is too much flow for a single overflow. You think I might split the pump output between the flow and say a Phos Reactor? That way the reactor flow goes back into the sump instead of going up into the display?

[PapaMcEuin]

Question on getting coraline to take hold. What do I do to spur it along? Should I find every little shell with coraline and glue to the back wall? My 2 yr old nano has had the hardest time getting purple coraline to grow though the SPS's are doing just fine.

[lReef lKeeper]

a single overflow with easily handle a mag 5. with head loss ... your actually only looking at about 300gph. higher cal, alk, and mag will help the coralline grow.

[PapaMcEuin]

Oh well, not all things end the way you want. Apparently the tank back wall as tempered as well though most just use tempered glass on the bottom. He went to drill it and it shattered into a thousand little pieces. Now where to go from here. My wife really likes the idea of a bigger tank on display downstairs and likes the job I did on the stand. I have also found that a local retailer sells this stand for $98.99 so recovering the full craigslist cost won't be happening either. I figure I could get $75 for it at most but that really leaves me out about $50 when you consider costs to acquire and refurbish. I could spend $100 on a new tank but have now defeated the purpose of a cheap deal. I did see a deaper 65 g at the same store that if I was going to spend more money on the tank would be of more interest. Have to rethink the plan.

[techguy]

Very sorry to hear the tank was a loss. I hope you find a way to get a new tank up and going with minimal investment.

[PapaMcEuin]

Well, did some quick looking and after a talk with my wife, she really wants to keep the stand as she really likes the finish work I did to it. So I have ordered a PRE-DRILLED tank with overflow and all the junk included from Aqueon. The Todd is going to use the money I already paid to drill and build the overflow towards the cost of the tank and he is selling near cost to save me some bucks as well. Given a 2003 price list I found, I know he is making something off the tank as I would expect a business owner to do but also helping me out since he will likely be making less overall since he is not reaping the benefit of making the overflow and all himself. So, going forward, a little more expensive but I like that it will be a bottom drilled setup rather than a back drilled. Would rather have as little as possible hanging over the back side of the tank. Essentially, I will pay about $60 to $80 more when it comes down to it.

[techguy]

That's awesome, I am glad to hear you are getting another tank!

Once it's all up don't forget the pictures

[CarmieJo]

Well that stinks about the first tank shattering. That would have made me sick. On the bright side, I am happy for you that you are going to get a new tank!

[PapaMcEuin]

Well, as it goes, this is hardly craigslist anymore. I was set to buy many used components from this person and they sold it out from under me while I was trying to arrange a pickup time and place. So that added with the broken tank, I have gone through several vendors and this just isn't the cheap project but still not too bad. I for better or worse have ordered a skimmer, pump, and lights from AquaTraders. I have read of problems but with the lights, the issues seem to be resolved from what I have read and with the skimmer it just takes a couple of weeks to break in. Also, since I will be submersing the skimmer in the sump, I don't care about the "leak" issues. I have ordered a Korallia flow pump to go along with another pump I had in the nano that was just way over powering. That plus the main in flow pump from the sump should suffice for water movement. I figure I will get my sand from Aquatica (local guy) and thinking to do a mix of just bag sand and one 20 lbs live sand to kick start the cycle. Now I am trying to decide on rocks.

So, Marco Rocks, has a deal 25 Lbs Key Largo for 59 http://www.marcorocks.com/index.asp?...PROD&ProdID=64. I was thinking about ordering 50 lbs from them. On the site, looks better in shape than local store live rocks which are always blocks and no design. Also, there is this other site, Tampa Bay Saltwater Aquacultured Life Rock that has some interesting live rock with stuff on it. I was thinking of getting a small amount, 20 lbs, from them maybe, but now I am wondering about what it will have on it in regards to the oil spill. I also have 30 lbs of rock that was in the nano that I removed that will be going in the new tank. So it will be about 100 lbs all in all. Otherwise, I found someone local on craigs list selling live rock for $2/lb and have asked that he send some pictures. That of course would be the cheapest route, but cost is not all I am concerned about since I would like it to look nice as well.

On the stand, I have one coat of interior/exterior urethane applied. I need to sand it and apply another coat and maybe repeat for a 3rd time. My wife does not want it to get to polished looking, but it does look nice. I am currently holding off on building a hood until I get the lights in and decide on how to handle/design that. I would like a hood, but if it is easy enough to let the fixture be as is, then that is how it will stay unless she decides she wants a hood to match. If that is the case, then I will disassemble the light and mount to the hood as well as add 2 PC bulbs to the light mix for 420nm coverage. The light is a 48 T5HO with 4 bulbs and 8? LEDs plus timer fans etc. http://shop.aquatraders.com/Odyssea-...es-p/52211.htm so anyway, we'll see how it all goes. I should be picking up the tank this coming Wednesday. So pending on all the craziness and going to Wisconsin next weekend, hopefully everything will get done and pictures before I leave, at least of a set up tank and a bed of sand with a few existing rocks.

[CarmieJo]

I have some Marco Rock and it is very nice. With the rock from your nano you could just use all the rest dry rock. I have my doubts about the value of live sand in a bag. Since you have a tank up and running you could just use sand from it to seed the new tank.

[PapaMcEuin]

Never thought about that. So you are saying take some sand from the current setup and just spread it over my new tank bed? How much should I use? That would really save a lot of money since I know I can get argo sand for $1/lb or less compared to $2 to $3.

[PapaMcEuin]

So, I put a second coat of urethane on the stand this morning. Will give it a light sand and do a 3rd and final coat tonight or tomorrow. The tank and sump should be ready for pickup tomorrow. The remaining equipment should be shipped today or tomorrow so I will have it all over the next few weeks. I have a response finally from some guy on Craigslist for live rock. Only problem I don't remember which post it went to, price or quantity. Pictures are of fresh live rock, not the current tank so I don't know what quality it is, but mostly the block looking stuff. Quite literally, a few look like cut blocks of pumice.
GetAttachment.jpg
For a more reef look, I think I may still order from Marco.

So questions now come up with timing. I am about to go to Florida for just over a week and have a friend watch the house, dogs, and tanks. He knows at least to check water levels and put in RODI water. What he will not be doing is water changes. So The tank being 55 gallon, a sump likely 20 gallon. If I use just bagged (non live) argo sand, what few pounds of live rock I have currently in my nano's 10 gallon sump and dead rock that I have plus may buy from Marco if not from Craigslist, should I expect that the cycle process go fine without any critters in the tank? I will take some sand from my nano to additionally seed the new tank and it may grab up a few hitch hikers. But, other than that, nothing will be added. So I will simply have sand rock equipment and saltwater. He will just be doing top of as needed. If I have it started by Monday next week and leave it for a week starting the following Saturday, I should be safe. It shouldn't go black death of anything. I don't plan on "speeding" up a cycle process with any forms of accellerents such as food or criters. But should I have him monitor Ammonia/Nitrates/Nitrites to have a cycle seen?

Also, one thing that I know was an issue in the past, coraline algae. I have been dosing with Purple up but it has done little to nothing in the nano. I am half empty on the bottle (shook every time I used) and now I am getting a heavy dosing out of it. And gee, the coraline is taking off. Maybe the new 420nm PC light I got a month and a half ago, but it is really growing now. Should I be dosing the new tank heavy while nothing is in it to get the levels up to where they need? I use InstantOcean. Is there something that has a better calcium buffer without becoming an indentured servant? I just wonder if dosing + InstantOcean will work and be more affordable long term. anyway, thoughts?

[PapaMcEuin]

So, here is the tank stand and the tank loaded with stuff bought so far. Well not much of a picture but at least you see the stand. The doors to be remounted soon. The stand to look at it is very dark, does not really show that much grain but the flash makes the grain stand out much more. On the door picture the one directly at my feet is what you normally see but on angle you can see the grain if the sun is peering through.

Stand Doors.JPGStand.jpgEquipment.JPG

Oh, the lights are to be delivered today and the overflow parts should be delivered on Wednesday for me to pick up on my way home from work.

[PapaMcEuin]

lights came in. got them put together and tested to make sure they work. Yep. Lights come on and all the buttons work. Will fool with the programming of it after the setup is running. For $109 that is 4 T5HO plus 4 sets of 2 LEDs, fans, and setup with a programmable timer that can do 2 bulbs at atime and the LEDs at night not bad. So I can have half lights for morning and evening then full lights for day time full power not bad. Reviews said all the problems with the lighting designs are fixed and were only on the HQI setups so hopefully everything works out fine. Now just waiting on the magnum flow accessory kit to come in. I guess I should order rocks.... Still haven't finished making my mind up though....

[Pat]

looking good ! wht power heads will you be using? im picking up a k4 and a k3 for my 90 gall.
i wish i got a driled tank but decided to change things up a lil lol

[PapaMcEuin]

I will have the inflow on one side where the overflow is (500GPH) and a Koralia Evolution (750 GPH) opposite of it. I have another "wave" maker that was supposed to move back and forth that I will likely use in the middle under the brace beam. It doesn't move as well as I hoped but likely because I had to turn down the flow for the nano I had it in. If not because of looks, then I will get another Koralia since it will have less space requirements and look much better.

To some extent, I am glad now that the first tank broke and have a bottom drilled tank. The location will have less space issues to deal with not having any hang on back mounted gear that takes up lots of space. The sump that was built for me should be extremely quiet. I like his design and I think I may disrupt my nano briefly to adapt the eshopps sump to his noise canceling design. Right now it is loud and fills the house with the sound of waterfall much more than I want to have. A background trickle is nice, but a constant rush of water is just getting on my nerves over the past year.

[PapaMcEuin]

What a crazy night. So I got everything finally and start the build. First had to clean out the wall in the breakfast area where the tank is going. Then move the stand up from the basement. Doors will go back on a few days later after this is all done. Here is a shot of the sump sitting up on the stand. Hasten told me I had to do the picture over again and have him in it.
Build01.jpg
In this one, you can see the setup of the sump. I really like his design. Much better in my oppinion than what is commercially available. But one problem which will be shown shortly.

Build02.jpg
I placed the equipment in and have fitted up the overflow on the tank. My wife kindly helped move it into position before heading to the grocery store. We talked about placement and all because next thing that happens is loading it up and after that, it ain't moving.

Build03.jpg
I cut a light diffuser down to fit the bottom so rock is not sitting directly on the glass, then cleaned off my old rock that has been sitting on the porch baking for the past few months. All the culpera should be dead, just hopefully no spider hitch hikers, well, had one big 2 incher but he did not like the fact my hot water from the tap runs at 140 F. I cleaned off all the stuff that was remaining, mainly one rock that had so much green star that I could not store it all when I pulled the rocks a few months back. Sorry, I did save 10 frags that are growing in my nano now, several have attached to the glass. Anyway, sorry. I then added 70 lbs of sand. Two grades of agro sand, 30 lbs CaribSea Agronite sugar size and 40 lbs Seaflor Super Reef Mix. I put the sugar sized down first and the covered with the Seaflor and finger mixed/leveled. Anyway, wife loves the rocks setup nice and simple, not crowded. So we most likely won't be getting any more rocks which is more than fine with me. didn't want to spend the extra. Oh, and I bought 115 lbs of sand, but I have at least 3 inches already and less than a quarter inch from the magflow setup's lower inlets are located so i don't want more that will clog those up. That will be a $50 return to the store today. So glad I decided to buy the locally. Had I not placed rocks first on the diffuser and not had the overflow taking up that corner, I would likely have needed at least the extra 15 lb bag.

Build04.jpg
Then I added water to the overflow and confirmed what I though, this setup won't work. Basically, the distance between tail and sump is so short I can't get a good seal. I then decided that I should go with basics, flow direction should go small into larger, not larger over small. So I cut off the PVC pipe that was welded in place, removed the bulkhead from the top of the sump altogether and stuck the extra length of hose I had on and down into the sump. Still need to go back and use a razor knife to cut it off just above the sock hang rack. but this mess isn't there any more. Tested after that and no leaking. Will likely go back and seal the space between the bulkhead insert hole and hose with silicone to kill the noise that may occur.

Build05.jpg
Tank with some water, rinsed the sand off the rocks and let it settle til morning.

Build06.jpg
Turned on the moon lights and went to bed.

Well, bed at 1am. Up at 2am to take sick dog out. Up again at 5:30 am to take out sick dog and stick them in the shower, clean up the mess, put more water in the tank, and get in shower to clean self and dogs. 2 Yorkies so can't just leave them outside at night. Hawks or foxes around here would have them for a snack. Goes to say I am tired today.

I have added more water so the korilia is running and added salt. Have to make more RODI water to fill sump and get the full system running. I also went ahead and dumped in purple up since the system is currently a complete dead system with nothing living and the InstantOcean is very weak on calcium.

I had asked Todd@Aquatica why PurpleUp lists copper and he said basically what they do is take the left over water and grunge from the sand they make and bottle it. So anything that was in the corals used to make the argonite sand ends up in purple up so it has all kinds of things in it. Well, hasn't killed my nano but won't buy it anymore after this. More pictures to come. Once I have my water filled and fully running, then to get the salinity right before putting in the live rock I have sitting in the nano's 10g sump. It has no growth on it, just whatever drops from the overflow which is mainly a few copods and live mysis, maybe a star. After that, daily monitoring for cycle events. I must remind myself, patience grasshopper!