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Thread: UV Sterilizers

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    UV Sterilizers

    Can anyone tell me if they are running a UV steriler and what brand/size? Is it worth the money? Any pictures of how it is connected to the system?

    Dick, I know you have one, any comments?

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    Crispy Reef Monkey **MOD** Phurst's Avatar
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    I used to run one on my 120. I got it for free, so i used it. I don't think I'd pay for another. it was a 25w Gamma UV unit. It did help clarify the water to some extent (although for my money O3 is a better choice), and somewhat reduced the need to wipe the glass. Getting the flow rate right for any given unit can be a bit tricky, and unless you get one of the units with the mechanism for wiping the quartz sleeve inside the unit, it requires at least monthly dissasembly and cleaning to remain effective.

    I guess the question is, what are you wanting to achieve by using one?
    **KEEP ME AWAY FROM SUPER GLUE ... i tend to glue my lips shut !!**

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    Grand Master Reefer Amphibious's Avatar
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    Dick, I know you have one, any comments?
    Who me? Have comments? You know me, I’ve always got comments.

    I’ve used UV sterilizers with great success for 40+ years. WHY??? Because they work! UV is are better than an insurance policy. An insurance policy of any type, health, auto, disability, life, will not keep you from suffering a loss but will ease the pain of the loss. A properly sized UV will lower the incidence of disease in your fish or reef tank. They do this by constantly keeping the free swimming stage of parasites in check. Will it prevent an outbreak under all circumstances? Probably not. BUT, the proper use of a UV should, in all likeliness, prevent an out of control spread of the disease. It’s also been reported to help clarify the water.

    Here’s one example of an experience I had four years ago when I set up my current 135 mixed reef. We reefers are always in a hurry to get some fish into our systems even though we know better. Perhaps more than anyone, I know better! But having 40+ years experience I feel there are times I can push the envelop. This new system had cycled and was ready for new fish. I did something I DO NOT RECOMMEND ANY OF YOU TRY TO DUPLICATE!!! I asked a trusted LFS to look for one of three Tangs for me, a Powder Blue, an Achilles or a Sohal Tang. The dealer called and said he got in all three and I could take my pick. Well I made what turned out to be a foolish decision. I bought the Sohal that day and put a hold on the other two. After a couple of days I went back and bought the other two. Here is the pic from May 2006...



    I was waiting on a new UV sterilizer to be delivered AND I was leaving town in a couple of weeks for four days heading up to Chicago for an IMAC show. Have you ever thought DUMB??? I went against my own rules. I hadn’t done anything this DUMB in many years. I feed my fish heavily with vitamin fortified food items. Vitamins I put into the mix. The fish were doing OK. They were eating like crazy, gaining strength, weight and, I assumed, their immune system was improving. There was this little problem, a spot of Ich was seen on each of the fish. It would come and go, as Ich will do. Where was that darned UV? I flew out to IMAC praying everything would be OK until I got back. My wife called the first night and said the UV got there that day. Damn, the luck! Well, when the master is away, the Ich exploded, as Ich tends to do when left unchecked. By the time I got home, disaster had struck. Swift was the havoc to 3 stressed Tangs that didn’t have sufficient time to build their immune system to optimum health and the UV came to late to help. All three died within days of my return. A Lesson here is get the UV installed BEFORE you have an outbreak of Ich.

    I had never been without one prior to about 1970 and I will never be without one since June 2006. I have not had an Ich outbreak nor any other pathogen since installing the UV. It’s a 25 watt pushing about 300 gal per hour through it. I say about because I’m not 100% positive because it is part of a manifold system where everything is valved, with the valves throttled down to distribute the water to various outlets.

    I swear by the use of a properly sized UV.

    Dick
    Amphibious

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    Amblyeleotris randalli commonly, Randall's Goby.

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    Thanks again guys for sharing your knowledge. I was hoping to clarify water, clear up algae problems and most importantly keep ich in check. Dick, I am sorry you lost your beautiful tangs, that must have been very upsetting, I'm sure by sharing that story and educating us all you have saved many fish.

    I have been up to no good the last few weeks, I have sold my 180 and bought a 270, yes a 270g, I am so excited, I bought the 270 for the same price as I selling the 180 with stand and some equipment. My hubby said he would build a stand, I married the right man. So I want to give this piece of the ocean the best beginning and thought I would install a uv, what size would you recommend?

    I may start a build thread for this one, I will have a few million questions.

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    Insightful Reefer AZDesertRat's Avatar
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    For a heavily stocked fish only system I swear by them but for a reef I would not have one. They inactivate a necessary part of the food chain needed by lower life forms.

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    Grand Master Reefer saltaddict's Avatar
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    I just ordered one today!! I had never had the "need" until now. We moved the tank two months ago to have flooring installed, the only spot was beside a window. It has caused nothing but algae since so I am hoping this will help. If not, oh well it was worth a try.

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    Grand Master Reefer Amphibious's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AZDesertRat View Post
    For a heavily stocked fish only system I swear by them but for a reef I would not have one. They inactivate a necessary part of the food chain needed by lower life forms.
    Would you explain that so I can have a better understanding of what you mean?

    Thanks

    Dick
    Amphibious

    Good Luck comes to those who research and prepare.


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    Amblyeleotris randalli commonly, Randall's Goby.

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    Hi Rhonda, let me know how it works for you. Dick, would you agree with this article which says we need 336,000 radiation to be effective with ich? Ozone Combo 120 Watt - Ozone UV Combo Series

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    Insightful Reefer AZDesertRat's Avatar
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    UV doesn't kill anything by itself, what it does is expose the cells to UV light which in essence sterilizes them so they cannot reproduce thus they die off.
    http://www.epa.gov/safewater/mdbp/pdf/alter/chapt_8.pdf

    We have used UV in the wate rand wastewater industry for years and it is an effective method of disinfecting wastewater without leaving a residual and can be used for drinking water but needs to be followed by chlorine as you want a residual disinfectant in the distribution system.

    Our use in the aquatics hobby is very similar and like I said I used one on my heavily stocked 90G community fish system with great success, I could actuall tell when the bulb was weak or the sleeve dirty just by the way the tank and inhabitatnts looked and moved around. In the reef though lower life forms need those protozoa you are destroying, or inactivating actually, and not allowing to multiply to feed them so they can in turn be consumed by pods which get eaten by fish etc. Eliminat any part of the food chain and you get a ripple effect bottom to top.

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    Thankyou for the explanation AZDesertRat.

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    Grand Master Reefer saltaddict's Avatar
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    Missy - I hooked up the UV this afternoon at 4:30 and the tank is almost clear now!! I will never be without it again.

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    So some people like Amphibious are swearing by a Uv filter. It has its pros but seems to have its cons as well if its killing off the protozoa. Is anyone here using a uv filter in there reef setup?

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    Master Reefer laurabolyard's Avatar
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    I would really like to know the answer to this question! My new (used) tank came with one, so I am tring to read all of the pros and cons before I decide to hook it up (dont even know yet if it works). I REALLY like to have pods, it would be a tough decision in that case.
    wow, time to update!!

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    Grand Master Reefer Amphibious's Avatar
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    You are going to get a lot of pros and cons from people forming their own opinion not from fact but from other’s opinions based on something less than fact. Talk to someone that has used them since the 1970s. Ummmmmm, that would be me.

    Fact - UVs kill or alter the DNA, so it can’t reproduce, of all living things that pass through the unit when the light is on and SIZED right.. Sized too small, pumping too much water through or turning the light off will have a negative effect on the results you get.

    Fact - UV does not have a MEASURABLE effect on the cycle because bacteria multiply at an enormous rate in the sand and LR when presented with food such as Ammonia and Nitrite. The only bacteria that the UV has an effect on is what is in the water column and ONLY WHEN IT PASSES THROUGH THE UNIT.

    Fact - UV has NO EFFECT On Ammonia and Nitrite.

    Fact - UV must be run 24/7 to be most effective.

    There’s probably some other myths out there I haven’t covered. I’ll deal with them as people bring them up.

    When sizing a UV for my system(s), I NEVER TAKE THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE MANUFACTURER! WHY??? Because his figures are more likely to be skewed in favor of a smaller unit being adequate, (Why? Lower price, more sales, because people don’t do their research and take the manufacturers specs as gospel). That may explain why there are so many people that are negative on UVs. Do ya think??? If you buy an 8 watt unit for a 55 gal because the manufacturer recommended his 8 W unit for a 55 and then experienced a breakout of Ich you couldn’t control, would you be happy? No! Would you be of the OPINION that UVs are not effective? YES! It’s not that they are not effective. It’s that the 8 W unit was realistically undersized.

    NOW, let’s clear up something else as long as we’re talking UV Sterilizers for disease control.

    Fact - UVs will not prevent Ich!!! WHAT, YOU SAY??? Why on earth would I spend between $100 and $500 for a UV if it doesn’t prevent Ich???

    Fact - When sized properly, maintained properly, run 24/7, the UV is very effective in controlling the outbreak of Ich and other pathogens from getting out of control. If you bring a perfectly healthy LOOKING PB Tang and introduce it into your UV Sterilized system, I can almost guarantee you will experience white spots on that PB. A proper UV will go along way in preventing the Ich from getting out of control. It will not cure it on the fish!

    Let’s get one other thing clarified right here and now. YOU would NEVER bring in a PB Tang OR ANY OTHER FISH with out QTing it first, RIGHT??? I didn’t think you would BUT, there are reefers out there that DO NOT QT. Can you imagine that??? So, the clarification is this - A UV IS NOT A REPLACEMENT TOOL TO ELIMINATE QUARANTINING!!!

    So what do I look for in buying a UV? the first thing I discard is PRICE! The next thing I look at is the brand. There are a number of brand name units that quite frankly are junk! Hence, the discarding of price. Don’t let CHEAP be your criteria. How do you decide which is junk and which is worthy of consideration? Shop around, ask people that use UV consistently. DO NOT listen to the nay sayers because most of them are repeating other nay sayer’s vomit! Listen only to people that are currently using them. Ask questions.

    Once you decide on a brand, sizing the unit is next important. I don’t care what manufacturer you choose. If for your system he recommends a 25 Watt unit, I’’ll recommend the 40 Watt unit. Here’s why...

    UV bulbs weaken over time. It’s recommended to change the bulb in 9 to 12 months. If you buy the 25 Watt unit as recommended by the manufacturer, it starts out with a 96 to 98% effectiveness rate and slowly drops. It’s recommended to be changed at 9 months because it’s effectiveness has dropped to MAYBE 75% (guessing here). Now, I buy the 40 Watt for the same system. It’s effectiveness is going to be more than the 25W, probably 100%. It should remain at 100% for quite some months. At the 9 and even the 12 month mark I don’t change the bulb. I keep on keeping on with my unit. At the 18 to 24th month I begin to think about changing the bulb. This has been very effective for me.

    OK, Dick is leaving the building, you can come out from under your desks, now.
    Amphibious

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    Amblyeleotris randalli commonly, Randall's Goby.

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    Grand Master Reefer Amphibious's Avatar
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    Oh, Laura my Dear, I didn’t answer your question specifically. You will have as many Pods as if you didn’t run the UV. What brand and size is the unit?
    Amphibious

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    Amblyeleotris randalli commonly, Randall's Goby.

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    Master Reefer laurabolyard's Avatar
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    THAT is the news I wanted to hear!!!! It may be the ONLY reason I may not use this thing aside from, say, it doesnt work or not sized properly!! ok, not much info yet, made by emperor aquatics and its about 2.5 ft long!!! Will try to find out more!
    wow, time to update!!

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    Grand Master Reefer Amphibious's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by laurabolyard
    It may be the ONLY reason I may not use this thing
    Ok, you have me confused. What reason would keep you from using it? I thought everything I posted was a positive FOR using it.
    Amphibious

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    Amblyeleotris randalli commonly, Randall's Goby.

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    Master Reefer laurabolyard's Avatar
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    yes!! My bad, you know I get a bit too excited! Rephrase... Losing pods would have been the only reason for me NOT to use it! I guess I cant think of any other aside from mentioned above (not working, not rated high enough).
    wow, time to update!!

    125 gl reef
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    Most people have skeletons in their closet, mine are in my sump!

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    Insightful Reefer AZDesertRat's Avatar
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    Also consider the power consumption, heat transfer to the water(which will be significant) and the fact you will probably be hard pressed to find one of sufficient size to do any good for a reasonable price. I would spend my money elsewhere as you probably will not see much if any benefit to using one and I did use one in the 70's and 80's myself too. For fish only I would consider one again, for a reef I would not waste my time and money since there are many more useful items to have.

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