I actually saw the Vortechs in action at the ReefStock meeting in Denver last month. Jake had them set up to produce waves, and I really liked the flow. I have no idea how it would work with a DSB though...it was just set up in a empty tank.
I love my Tunze streams, although I have to admit that I'm having a B of a time at the moment keeping the sand down. Especially after having purchased two sand gobies that swim around the tank stirring everything up. Everything that sifts through their gills gets caught up in the current and swept around the tank. I have to blow off all my rocks now every few days...quite a pain.
I think it's more like you are flamming me buddy.
Chill out already...
They are great pumps alright if you're into "gadgets" and empty promises like the wireless controller that is not really wireless and has more wiring that my MJ mods... Oh did I mention that it only works by line of sight? What the hell kind of hooptie wireless controller is that?
Oh yeah don't forget that it is expected/recommended that you replace the wetside (at your cost) every 18 months, a pretty expensive ongoing maintenance cost if you ask me.
I don't really understand what you mean by "chill out", as I don't see any heat in my reply but if you were offended, I apologize. No, I'm not a shill for Vortech and I do take offense at that. I like the pumps and I guess you don't so there you have it.
Firstly id like to say im nutral in this disscussion/ flame match, cause we dont have their newer stuff down here yet.
Secondly id like to discuss this with everyone, although dirrected more-so at D comments so far.
Your points are definately valid on some levels bud, however keep in mind someones got to be on the consumer arm of development. Companies are forever bringing out the new & improved gear based on their R&D & consumer feed back. . Buy it, like it, love it, hate it, each to their own. If your a radio shack kinda person then i guess you have probable cause to bitch about the line of site controller & its functionality, but i ask you, whats the point in changing settings in another part of the house when you cant see whats happening. Its a cool,versatile & funky freedom gimick, nothing more, & its just a suggestion but id treat it as such with the notion that its equiptment with a primary static function first & formost.
Second point id like to bring up is 18 months on replacement parts in my opinion is not a bad shelf life, considering its the life blood of your tank & on 24hrs a day for almost 2 years with little to no incident sounds pretty good to me. If everyone wasn't trying to stuff the entire diversities of the oceans into their tanks you'd find you wouldn't be harping to the same degree about routine costs.
Just food for thought anyways, feel free to flame me though, cause it makes for good threads when you get me started!
V-
I agree with some of what you said about the R&D process and trust me I've been involved in R&D (both software and hardware) long enough to know how this works. That said though, the Vortech has been out for quite a while now and if anything their quality control should have gotten better not worse. Their customer service (provided by IceCap) is second to none granted but a great product should not require so much servicing especially when the pumps are brand new. Just a quick browse to their vendor forum on RC will give you an idea as to the problems people are having Reef Central Online Community - EcoTech Marine If you ask me I think IceCap got a lemon out of this partnership with EcoTech.
As for the 18 month replacement period, this is not a sign of a great product, especially after you just shelled out $350 for the pump now you are expected to shell out an additional $60 every 18 months. Reef Central Online Community - Rust on my 2 month ols Vortechs
It is never normal to see oxidation (rust) like that on a magnet. Heck my Maxijets and Tunze never needed anything replaced and they are over 5 years old.
Agreed that most people do not need to run a 3000 gph pump at full blast in their tanks but for some (like me) the flow is definitely required. In my honest opinion, if the Vortech cannot be run at 100% capacity then EcoTech needs to revise their rating of this product and state this accordingly. It's their false advertisement and empty promises that really get to me.
The line of sight thing is definitely a problem when you have things (accidental or otherwise) obstructing it. Try walking between the wireless controller and the pump and see what happens. And where is the night mode that was promised by EcoTech? Tunze can do all these things so why can't these guys get their act together over there at EcoTech?
Yes I know about Foster's, that was my subtle attempt at humor, I only drank VB when I was down there. About the wireless feature, I think it needs some explaing as you have it half right. The wireless feature is between two (or more, up to 10 I believe) controllers not the pump and the controller. If you have one pump it is a useless feature. I posted over at RC that I thought it was a little silly since you have wires going from the power supply to the controller and from the controller to the pump, what would another thin wire mean between controllers? Not much considering I also have a thin wire running from my battery backup. I have both controllers right next to each other so the sight line issue (between the controllers) is not a problem but it could be for some mounting options. Do you have the pumps? You started this thread noting that there are issues with some plexi tanks which I think is a horrible problem and you are right to bring it up. I had a plexi tank and hated it but would have hated it even more if I bought my votechs and crazed it. I agree about the night mode but I still like the pumps a lot. The purpose of these threads is for people to give real world experience, right?
As for Ozzie beer, i try not to drink it much these days, cause its reaching import prices, & its more exotic to drink anything with a tag "import" lol
Besides, you should try some of my homebrew! Ive redefined the blend between ozzie & mexican beer! Just dont ask what the secret ingredient is?
Guys, If you going to banter with each other - thats how to do it! well done!
At the end of the day, after we have ping ponged ideas & opinions back & forth between eachother we walk away with a mutual respect, if not for eachother,at the very least for the site, thats the key differences between us, & say RC.
Now- next person that brings up that parasitical salt board again im going to shootem! .lol No...J/K, Im just going to hurt them alittle bit.
Now just to put some perspective on my question here, $60 is a case of my above mentioned import beer, which takes about 4-6hrs socal drinking to consume, I just wanted to add that to put the costs of routine maintanence or renewal of equiptment. Having said that, to replace it due to potential rusting, thats not good. Whats the coating material made from?
You should check out the recently split thread on the Solaris Leds over there, it's why I like TR better.
RC is a wealth of information that is often hard to reach. Tanks threads that are largely comprised of OT chit-chat are a bit hard to wade through. I find it laughable that people congratulate eachother on a thread "split" when it is largely the product of OT banter.
I am not adverse to civil arguments, after all I am part Italian. Our dinner table was filled with passionate discussion when I was young.
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Regarding the Vortech, I think Ecotech has made the pumps limitations quite clear in the manuals and FAQs. No one has presented clear data on what percentage of Vortechs have QC issues, so I am not sure it is fair to use "lemon" language to describe a situation with which we are not privy.
The Vortech's design clearly exposes vulnerabilities that Maxijets and Tunze pumps do not have, and a company cannot always predict every environment that their product will be used. I know consumers are sometimes quick to take the consumers side, but one cannot assume that Ecotech was liable in this situation. Perhaps they were, perhaps they were not. It sounds as if the pump, despite the tank owner's attempts to down-throttle, got stuck on full blast and went unnoticed until the crazing had occurred. Is this Ecotech's fault that the pump malfunctioned? Perhaps... Is it the fault of the tank owner that there was not enough ventilation for the worst case scenario? Perhaps... It is hard to say without getting both sides and examining the tank.
Does this make Ecotech liars and false advertisers? The pumps can be pushed to 3000gph, and the motor will heat up to 145-150 degrees. The environment has to accommodate that.
Now, let me turn on my own tank. What if my Vortech got stuck on full blast, and my DSB got plowed and ALL my inhabitants died as a result. Would that make me mad? YES. Would that make me seek compensation? Probably, but IMHO, seeking is different than expecting. I know that the Vortech's capabilities (3000gph) can tear my tank up pretty bad, and that it runs by a controller board (computer), which means mechanical error AND electronic error put my tank at more risk than a simple Maxijet. At least with a traditional 1500gph pump, you do not have this type of risk.
Let us take this one step further. Let's say I used Maxijets instead, and deployed the crappy suction cup mounts to hold my Maxijets in place. A few weeks, perhaps months down the road my suction cups fail and my DSB gets torn up - Is the Maxijet manufacturer responsible for the resulting damage?
Just dont ask what the secret ingredient is? 
V-series Productions 
Linear Mode
