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Old 08-14-2006, 07:51 PM   #1 (permalink)
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trace elements

im very new to saltwater and i am setting up a 24 gallon nano i picked up "nano reef
Part A and part B. it says it replenishes the trace elments that get depleted in a reef aquarium, i was planing on adding it when i start stocking my aquarium but just a few minuets a ago i was reading in "aquarium corals, selction, husbandry, and natrual history" by eric borneman that some people say they arent needed and some do so i wanted to know what everyone else here thinks about them.
thanks
shawn
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Old 08-14-2006, 07:55 PM   #2 (permalink)
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This might be stupid of me asking but trace elments of what?

oh and im not sure if i had said this to you or not, but
Welcome to Talkingreef.com maybe alittle late
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Old 08-14-2006, 08:01 PM   #3 (permalink)
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thanks
strontium,iodine,magnesium,iron thats mainly what the book talks about
and the nano reef part a and b replenishes calcium, magnesium strontium,potassium,and iron
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Old 08-14-2006, 08:22 PM   #4 (permalink)
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If you do normal water changes you may not need the 2 part stuff. I would test your CA and see where u are at before you dose. What kind of salt will you be using? What are your plans for the tank?
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Old 08-14-2006, 08:23 PM   #5 (permalink)
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ok here is what i dose for.
Calcium
Iodine
and soon magnesium if need be.

I am still learning alot about this. so i cant really answer the rest but the calcium is a must. the iodine is up to you. i test and treat my iodine as i beleive it helps the corals. i have heard of people treating iodine without messureing for iodine. but i wouldnt, iodine can crash our hole system if its to great. im learning about magnesium right now but so far i think that magnesium takes a big tole on calcium and alkalinity. not everyone does messure for mag but im not everyone
I wish i could help you more.. i will be learning along with you on this thread i hope
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Old 08-14-2006, 08:35 PM   #6 (permalink)
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I agree with gwen in a perfect world water changes fix everything. Problem is I for one don't do them enough so I currently dose Kent essential elements it tells you how much and how often with water changes.
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Old 08-14-2006, 08:35 PM   #7 (permalink)
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the salt i am using is coralife but i plan on switching to either reef crystals or red sea
my plans for the aquarium were to have mostly easy to care for corals like soft corals and mushrooms and some lps
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Old 08-14-2006, 08:38 PM   #8 (permalink)
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If you are using a "reef" type salt which has higher CA, then you may not need the 2 part stuff. You need to test though before you start dosing. Buy Salifert test kits.
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Old 08-14-2006, 08:49 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Gwen, i used red sea test kits. is there any benifits of using salifert test kits?
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Old 08-14-2006, 08:56 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Saliferts are better quality. If you ask which test kits reefers prefer, it seems 99% say Salifert.

I do have a Seachem test kit which works fine for me, but Salifert is always the better option.
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Old 08-14-2006, 09:25 PM   #11 (permalink)
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i agree with gwen... if using a good salt regular water changes shoudl be aebough to keep up..

either way, you should not not dose what you arent testing..
so make sure you test for the Ca, Alk, and Magnesium at the least.

then dose as needed.

as you see the answer here is very easy... you dont need our opinions on this, if you test you will "know" what you need to add..

HTH..
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Old 08-14-2006, 09:32 PM   #12 (permalink)
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thanks for all the imformation it really helps
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Old 08-19-2006, 08:25 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Sorry I missed this one, Fishyshawn Welcome to TR.

For a 24 gal. ( which after sand and lr is closer to 18 Gal.) start with just doing weekly water changes. If you think something is off test first. If you are not testing before you dose any supplement you can overdose your tank very quickly sence you dont have the large volume of water to dilute it. Plus with the smaller volume of water, water quality is much more importante. water changes being the best way to remove excess nutrients and detritus.
IMO Supplements are for in-between water changes on larger tanks, and large bio loads. Two things we dont have in Nano tanks ( unless you are stocking fish)

As far as which salt to use. I have tryed Instant ocean, Tropic Matrin, and oceanic. None seem to be beter than the other, so the best rule is if your corals are happy with it use it.
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Old 08-21-2006, 09:48 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I think that we missed the core of the question though> If im right, I believe that he is using that Kent Marine nano stuff. Now according to our local distributor here in Az. Nanos are sometimes notorious for precipitation due to lots of RO add-on and Evap. This throws some peoples tanks for the PH loop, so to speak. The Kent is a PH and alk additive. It is also diluted for someone with small tank parameters. Nifty idea but I would have to try it out for awhile to see if it compares to seachem or B-ionic and aqua-c. just a thought.
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Old 08-22-2006, 12:05 AM   #15 (permalink)
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to Talking Reef Community and Podcast, fishyshawn.

Trace elements
Quote:
Originally Posted by fishyshawn
some people say they aren't needed and some do so i wanted to know what everyone else here thinks about them.
Trace elements are part of the building blocks of life and are utilized in the motabolism of the critters we keep in our aquariums. Hence, their need for replacement. Artificial sea water, in most brands, is mixed to duplicate natural sea water in about 70 elements. However, some brands cheat a little on some elements. To compensate for this some manufacturers have more than one formula. Instant Ocean (IO) comes to mind because it's the brand I've used for about 36 years. It's a good salt and the most popular because it has the reputation of being of consistent high quality. Instant Ocean also markets "Reef Crystals" which is more expensive and more complete in it's formulation.

So, what's the difference? Not a lot IMHO. If you mix up a batch of Instant Ocean and then test it before you use it, you might be surprised to find that the Calcium level, at 35ppm (Specific gravity of 1.025), is 350ppm. The Calcium level of natural sea water is 450ppm. Is this a big deal? Not if you have a fish only tank. But, in a reef tank instead of making up for Calcium lost to the metabolism of your critters you are actually diluting them further. So, the importance of measuring (testing) for Calcium levels on a regular basis becomes clear. Why does Instant Ocean, the most popular salt on the market, do this??? I don't know. I guess we'd have to ask them.

When I mix a batch of Instant Ocean for water changes I added Calcium and test to be sure I'm adding water with 450ppm of Calcium. If you mix and test Reef Crystals for Calcium you'll read 450ppm. Are Reef Crystals worth the extra money? Not in my opinion. I can add Calcium cheaper than the difference in price.

My reason for telling you this is not to condemn IO, after all I've been using it for a long time but, to point out to you and others that testing is one of the most important tasks you need to perform on a regular basis, especially in a nano tank. That small volume of water can and will change on you in an instant (figuratively speaking). You can't be guessing that you need to add this or that. A great rule of thumb in reefing is, if you can't or aren't testing for it don't add it. Just because a manufacturer puts chemicals in a bottle, slaps a cute Nemo fish on the label and says something like, "Essential Trace Elements for Nemo" add 2oz per gallon every other week to your reef aquarium, doesn't mean you need to add it at all. Many times they are playing on our ignorance of the subject and looking out for their bottom line. Don't get me wrong, there are some good and necessary trace elements but learn what is needed and what is junk before spending your money and possibly upsetting your reef tank.

I hope this makes sense and helps you.
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Old 08-22-2006, 12:26 AM   #