okay...obviously I need to re-do all my pictures again since the site warp...i'll get to that, but at the moment, I NEED YOUR HELP!!!!!
I will try to re-capture the posts that I had left over the past week, which are now floating through cyberspace....
Exactly one month ago, we completely re-did the aquascaping and placed the plastic crates with PVC feet underneath to support the rocks and keep them from sitting directly on the sand. A few days later the tank began to go cloudy.
One month prior to this, all of the tank parameters had leveled of at the following values: pH 8.1-8.2
KH 6
Ca2+ 400ppm
Mg2+ 1275 NO3 0 PO4 0
NH4 0
however, the skimmer had stopped producing any foam. It had been on and off since the start, but then completely stopped producing.
Here's a recap:
November 2nd - rearranged rocks and used plastic crates as stands
November 4th - skimmer finally producing
November 9th - added 47 turbo snails, 1 abalone, 1 pom-pom crab, 1 sally lightfoot, 5 hermits, 1 sea urchin, and 1 horseshoe crab
November 11th - tank begins to get cloudy
November 12th - even more cloudy, nitrates and phosphates at zero
November 19th - still very cloudy. We took skimmer completely apart to see if there was some debris trapped somewhere. Raised sump levels to 24 cm. No change in skimmer production. Still at zero.
November 21st -
okay, at this point, I was finally able to measure some phosphates (0.1 ppm)
and, much to our surprise, the silicates (SiO2) were very high (1 mg/ml). This completely baffled us, so we tested the RODI water, which has a TDS meter on it and shows zero, and sure enough, the RODI water was also at zero. ??? No idea where the silicates are coming from.
Keep in mind, all sand is aragonite-based, as well as the rocks.
November 22nd - traded skimmer with LFS's skimmer (same model). Mine worked in his tank. His didn't work in mine. ??? Decided to buy an Organics kit and measure the levels. The Salifert kit is a bit subjective, but the values appeared to be high at any rate. 1 cup of BioPhos was added, as well as active carbon. Measured K+ as well (250 - okay, not great, but certainly not the cause of the cloudiness).
November 23rd -
We decided to remove the plastic crates, as it was our fear that maybe there was something still on them, or there were some kind of softeners being released into the water. We can't figure out what else would be causing the high levels of organics, except of course for the fact that the
skimmer is still not producing any foam!!!!
December 1 - the skimmer had a glorious hour of skimming beautiful foam, and then suddenly stopped again. A very large (450 liter) water change was done and the lights have been off for almost 2 weeks now, with very little change in the cloudiness.
December 3rd
KH - 5-6
Ca2+ - 440
Mg2+ - 1410
K+ - 275 pH - 8.1 PO4 - 0.01-0.03
SiO2 - 1mg/L NO3 - zero
NH4 - zero NO2 - zero
Organics - high again???
We are leaving for the US in two weeks and I HAVE TO have this tank running smoothly by then, because I need to shut down the other tank and move over the inhabitants and corals before we leave.
I am desperate at this point and ready to completely give up on this tank. I have tons of live in the sand, lots of bristle worms and other little black worms. I have lost a few snails, but the rest are doing fine. The abalone, sea urchin and crabs are all still alive and looking good. I don't think that there's any kind of toxic substance in the tank, otherwise these creatures wouldn't have survived.
But, for the life of me, I can't figure out why the tank is cloudy and what to do about it. I no longer believe that it's a bacterial bloom...it would have subsided over 4-5 days. There is a tinge of green to the cloudiness, which leads me to believe that there is probably some plankton grown; however, leaving the lights off for 2 weeks had NO impact.
Gosh, this sounds super frustrating! My first thought was that there must be some manufacturing residue (maybe silicone grease) on the crates. That would explain the lack of skimmate and maybe the cloudiness. But you would think a 25% water change would make a difference. Do you have a DE or cannister filter with a micron cartridge? That might help clear the symptom and then your tank's defenses could take over.
have we determined if its elemental or organic yet?
Its a far stretch - but how well did you clean the tank before hand & with what cleaning product? Im hoping straight up vinagar water.
its possible that its from your plastic intruductions, however still affecting bubbles after so long seems plain weird. You would notice the residue straight away on the surface, not to mention the dump pipe flow would change visually & auditably. I know this is a new tank, but im sure you've had others with sumps- Any inconsistancy in this department RB.
Plus you have had minal losses in the animal department, which would dictate another problem.
did you manage to take a sample to work for testing?
Even putting it under the scope & see whats shaken might shed some light!
Did you turn your pumps down & manage to pick up some floc so you can at least see in there?
Process of elimination RB, get cracking & we'll see what we can nut out for you!
You have a real puzzler here. I've read and reread your posts and for the life of me, I can't see anything wrong. I have a couple of questions that don't seem important but...
I noticed your Mg2 levels have climbed from 1275 to 1440 and then dropped to 1410. What source of Mg are you using?
I have doubts about the plastic grating leaching anything into the water but don't know for positive.
I wish I could be there to actually see your system. Some times pictures and descriptions just don't give a truly accurate analysis of the subtleties of a system. You have me baffled.
I hope you find a clear solution soon. Pun intended.
I'm feeling helpless.
Dick
__________________ Amphibious
Reaching my 70th BD, I realize that I cannot help but grow old. However, I refuse to grow up!!! My wife would tell you, "He may be 70 but, He's going on 17". Life is wonderful with a woman like that.
Do you have a DE or cannister filter with a micron cartridge? That might help clear the symptom and then your tank's defenses could take over.
Yes, we have had a filter running 24/7 for two weeks now and we're changing the filter wadding every two days, so that we don't run into any nitrate problems. The wadding is always dirty, so I'm glad that we're pulling stuff out, but it's not clearing up the tank.
We are also running BioPhos and active carbon as well...
have we determined if its elemental or organic yet?
Well...the organic test kit reads high organic levels, but in my opinion this would be high anyway, since the skimmer isn't pulling anything out. I'm not so psyched about this test kit, because it tells me nothing about the types of organics. Are they toxins, oils, old water??
Quote:
Originally Posted by veriann
Its a far stretch - but how well did you clean the tank before hand & with what cleaning product? Im hoping straight up vinagar water.
We didn't use any cleaning products...just plain old water. We scrubbed it down. We had the tank filled with water for one week as well, just to make sure that the floor was going to hold before setting up the whole system. So, anything in there should have been well-diluted and washed out.
By the way, the tank was up and running, completely cycled, beautifully clear for over two months before this cloudiness set in!
Quote:
Originally Posted by veriann
its possible that its from your plastic introductions, however still affecting bubbles after so long seems plain weird. You would notice the residue straight away on the surface, not to mention the dump pipe flow would change visually & audibly. I know this is a new tank, but im sure you've had others with sumps- Any inconsistency in this department RB.
I have never had problems in my other tank with bubbles popping or skimmate not being produced. Even if I have seen residues on the water surface, the skimmer was always able to take them out.
In the new tank, however, I see NO residues or film at the surface of the water and notice nothing strange about the overflow dump pipe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by veriann
Plus you have had minor losses in the animal department, which would dictate another problem.
the only animals that I've lost have been snails. In my experience sea urchins are much more sensitive and mine looks great, as well as the crabs. I don't know about everyone else, but in an order of 50 snails, I always seem to lose a few....not fun, but I think it's par for the course. Also, my lights have been off for over two weeks, there's no fish producing any feces, I'm not feeding, so I think there is less and less for the inverts to feed on. I actually started feeding algae a couple of days ago, especially for the urchin and the abalone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by veriann
did you manage to take a sample to work for testing?
Even putting it under the scope & see whats shaken might shed some light!
I have had a work load the size of Mt. Everest the past few weeks...no time for play in the lab, although it's on my "to do" list. I just have to have time to process it right away in the morning, when I come into to the lab...that's the main problem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by veriann
Did you turn your pumps down & manage to pick up some floc so you can at least see in there?
Process of elimination RB, get cracking & we'll see what we can nut out for you!
I just asked my LFS yesterday to order some water clarifier for me. I was hesitant at first (as was he) to use clarifier, as this would only clear up the symptom, not the problem, but at this point, I can't imagine anymore what the problem might be. Maybe it's the symptom itself! So, I'm going to try that as soon as I get my hands on some.
I haven't turned the pumps down though...do you recommend doing this??
First of all...thanks you guys for your time and concern. I really appreciate it!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amphibious
I noticed your Mg2 levels have climbed from 1275 to 1440 and then dropped to 1410. What source of Mg are you using?
Yes, the Mg2+ levels were dropping, because I wasn't dosing. I was too focused on getting the system set up. But, I have since then added magnesium (ZEOmag from Korallen Zucht) to the calcium reactor, hence the raised levels. I'm not sure why it's dropped back down to 1410, other than that's it just plateaued out at that level.
I wish I could be there to actually see your system. Some times pictures and descriptions just don't give a truly accurate analysis of the subtleties of a system. You have me baffled.
Yes...I wish that some expert could come over and check out my tank. I'm about to give up.....
Let's hypothesize and say that there was something that leached from the crates. What would I need to do to get rid of it? And why are the silicates so high? What are the other possible sources of silicates? They're coming from something in the system. RODI and freshly made saltwater are zero. So, the only other source is the sand or rocks. Could it be that it's just a diatom bloom, or plankton bloom? Wouldn't that source itself out at some point, especially with the lack of light??
By the way, I did put the lights on yesterday, and I feel that after a couple of hours, the cloudiness gets worse, which must mean that something is feeding off the light.
Guess what?! I think I figured something out today. After having a long talk with my LFS, we had the idea to put a new, freshly imported rock in from Indonesia. Something really dead/decaying to get a little cycle going. Then, I thought...well, instead of putting the rock in, why not put some of the skimmate from the other tank in?
I know I know...you probably think I'm absolutely crazy.....but....guess what?!
It's incredible...but it did. I put some skimmate in around the skimmer intake...just a little bit...and voila! the skimmer started to foam. I waited a bit and then put some into the main tank.
Here's what we figured out. I jump started the system with Zeovit bacteria, ZeoStart, and ZeoFood. I've been dosing the ZeoStart and ZeoF
icon under their name to add to their reputation. 
V-series Productions 
So, I'm going to try that as soon as I get my hands on some.