hi everyone, im new to this site and look forward to reading peoples posts,
i have a major problem,
i thought i had to much substrate in my 250L tank so decided to take some out so that i was leaft with about 1inch,
since i have moved live rock about and disturbed the substrate all my fish,
1 yellow tang
1 blue regal
2 damsels
2 orange clowns
have died in less than 10 mins i did,nt even have time to get a spare tank set up,
what i find strange of all though is that it was just the fish that died i also have 2 cleaner shrimps
4 hermits 2 blue 2 red
and some snails which are all still alive and kicking,
i tested the most important water paramaters and seem ok ammonia 0ppm nitrite 0ppm nitrate 0pmm phosphate 0.03ppm
anyone have any clues
thanks in advance bearusa
ps i,m also suffering with a bit of brown algae which i was advised taking some substrate out might cure
Well my guess is Your blue tang either had ich and took the other fish down with it cause a blue tang needs a 6ft tank. Or your blue tang died and realised a diese it had and whipe your whole tank im just guessing.. nothing to do with ur substrate unless you dont take care of your tank and your tank was holding bad debrits and stuff while you stired up you stired up the stuff and got into the gills of fish or what ever and killed em. Or some toxins idont know
Hi Bear and to TR. I am sorry to hear of your troubles. I agree with Jace that your tank is likely too short for a regal tang unless it is long for the volume as they need a tank of at least 1.8 m. But am not convinced that it was the source of the deaths.
Without knowing all the details of how long your tank has been set up, how deep the sand was or how soon after removing the sand that the deaths occurred my first guess is that when you took out the sand you released nasties like hydrogen sulfide into the water.
thanks for the replys, i have had my tank setup since summer 2006 when i started off with just 2 yellow tailed damsels and 2 orange clowns, i have a 4.5 foot tank 250 litres about 60-63 us gallons,
as i think about it i,m tending to think it was hydrogen sulphide gas but wouldent these wipe out my inverts aswell,
as to the regal tang tank size i have a book called the marine aquarium by NICK DAKIN isbn 1902389670
which states tank size must be atleast 4ft and a volume of 54 us gallons,
i have had my tank now 2 years and still i class myself as a beginner so any advice from you guys will be greatly apreciated,
Well my guess is Your blue tang either had ich and took the other fish down with it cause a blue tang needs a 6ft tank. Or your blue tang died and realised a diese it had and whipe your whole tank im just guessing.. nothing to do with ur substrate unless you dont take care of your tank and your tank was holding bad debrits and stuff while you stired up you stired up the stuff and got into the gills of fish or what ever and killed em. Or some toxins idont know
none of my fish were scrathing or flicking on the rocks there was defo no disease in tank,
thinking about it i go with carmie,s reply about hydrogen sulphide gas,
although i deeply regret and feel sadened by the loss, this will not put me off the hobby
i,m determined to get it right and have learned an expensive lesson
but thanks for your advice
Hi Bear and to TR. I am sorry to hear of your troubles. I agree with Jace that your tank is likely too short for a regal tang unless it is long for the volume as they need a tank of at least 1.8 m. But am not convinced that it was the source of the deaths.
Without knowing all the details of how long your tank has been set up, how deep the sand was or how soon after removing the sand that the deaths occurred my first guess is that when you took out the sand you released nasties like hydrogen sulfide into the water.
basic setup comprises of the following
4.5 foot tank 250litres about 60-63 us gallons
did have about 3 inchs of live sand and aragonite spheres now reduced to 1 inch
rena xp 2 canister filter packed with 2course 2 medium foams bag of carbon
2 rena power flow 2000ph 1400 litres an hour each
2 hydor koralia movement and circulation turbo pumps at 2300 litres an hour each
1 red sea prizm pro skimmer to suit a 400litre tank
over tank luminaire 2blue t5,s 2 white t,5s
i also have my own r/o unit for fresh and salt mixes which i prepare 3 days in advance of water changes, i do a 25% water change every other week and my canister filter every 4 weeks,
oh and also a uv sterilzer
and about 25 30 kilos of fijian love rock.
also when doing water changes i use an automatic siphon kit and regularly sift through the sand by the sounds of things not often enough,
Well Bearusa I hate to tell you but your book is rong aboug blue tangs. EVERY SINGLE TANG NEEDS ATLEAST A 6FT TANK. With some exception NOT THE BLUE TANG. with experts. Im not trying to flame you but tangs swim miles and miles and miles and miles everyday in the ocean. Looking for food. SO you need atleast a 6ft tank with lots of open swiming area. Im glad you where abile to keep your blue tang for as long as you did. but there hard esphilly when you dont meet the requirements. Sorry if this came out harsh The caps is what should be bolded. I did not mean to be mean But.. you shouldent just read one book and agree with that. And dont agree with LFSs they are always 80% of them rong too and just want you to waste money. sorry agin if this upset you.
-Jace
Well Bearusa I hate to tell you but your book is rong aboug blue tangs. EVERY SINGLE TANG NEEDS ATLEAST A 6FT TANK. With some exception NOT THE BLUE TANG. with experts. Im not trying to flame you but tangs swim miles and miles and miles and miles everyday in the ocean. Looking for food. SO you need atleast a 6ft tank with lots of open swiming area. Im glad you where abile to keep your blue tang for as long as you did. but there hard esphilly when you dont meet the requirements. Sorry if this came out harsh The caps is what should be bolded. I did not mean to be mean But.. you shouldent just read one book and agree with that. And dont agree with LFSs they are always 80% of them rong too and just want you to waste money. sorry agin if this upset you.
-Jace
i fully understand what your saying and do take on board your comments,
i am upset and saddened by the loss of my fish and am only really still a beginner at this wonderful and colourful hobby its gonna take me years to learn but damn it i am 100% commited to getting this right
thanks again
bearusa
bearusa dont worry about being a bigginer and feeling bad because to tell you the truth were all beginers and we all learn something new every day even though most of us are true masters at this hobbie they still learn new stuff because this is a learning hobbie and to me when I learn something new I feel even greater than when I didnt know it. I hope this helps and Im glad you are doing everything you can to figure this out and Im happy that you came to this wonderful sight to get adive so I leave you with saying good luck and happy reefing.
Hello Bear Sorry to hear of the rough time you have been experiencing. Don't take it too much to heart as we all have some type of problem or set back now and then. (Believe me, I should know!) I'm trying to follow along to all the threads in your post so forgive me if I tend to overlook anything. I noticed that you used the word "substrate" instead of LS and when CJo replied interpreting it as sand, and you responded in like..... that your substrate is actually aragonite sand and not crushed coral. I also thought I saw mention of a brown algae, which I am assuming is the reason for the removal of the substrate? If I am correct here, what was the reason the LFS told you that that would solve the problem? I don't mean to put you on the defensive by no means, as I am just trying to understand it. I am just baffled at why they would suggest that. It's fine to clean the top layer of the LS clean, but normally we do not want to disturb the depth of the bed due to the good bateria living there that must have no contact with oxygen to survive. That's why many hobbiest have deep sand beds, for the nitrafying bateria.
I am not as experienced as CJO, but I too believe that sulphide poisoning could very well be the culprit. I am also thinking that your tank could very well experience some type of cycle also getting your water parameters out of whack. You might want to keep a close eye on them and make adjustments accordingly. Also, you are right on the money to keep doing water changes very frequently as there could be things released from the sand bed now that you may not be able to test for. Just a thought that came to mind.
And kudos to you, you're my kind of reefer due to your positive attitude and determination!
Code:
"I am upset and saddened by the loss of my fish and am only really still a beginner at this wonderful and colourful hobby its gonna take me years to learn but damn it i am 100% commited to getting this right."
i agree with hydrogen sulfide poisoning. this is one reason that we suggest NEVER digging deep into the sandbed. there are all kinds of nasties in there.
__________________ Bobby
"I FORMERLY glued animals to rocks" NO TANK RIGHT NOW, but you never know when I might throw one together !! I have everything I need but the time!!
Show people you appreciate their advice! Click the icon under their name to add to their reputation.
Did you smell any rotten egg smell when you were removing the sand? Inverts can be more resistant to stress than fish so that may be why they survived. It could have been some bizarre disease but to have them all go in 10 minutes seems like an environmental factor.
the lfs guy said i was probally suffering a bit of brown algae cause of stuff building up in the sand, he said it wont hurt to take a lot of it out leaving roughly an inch (25mm) he said although i siphon water out with a sand/gr
to TR. I am sorry to hear of your troubles. I agree with Jace that your tank is likely too short for a regal tang unless it is long for the volume as they need a tank of at least 1.8 m. But am not convinced that it was the source of the deaths. 
icon under their name to add to their reputation. 
© Copyright Max Strandberg
Sorry to hear of the rough time you have been experiencing. Don't take it too much to heart as we all have some type of problem or set back now and then. (Believe me, I should know!) I'm trying to follow along to all the threads in your post so forgive me if I tend to overlook anything. I noticed that you used the word "substrate" instead of LS and when CJo replied interpreting it as sand, and you responded in like..... that your substrate is actually 
