Hey all,

I need to pick your brains again...

I've been using Reef Crystals (mixed to 1.026 SG at 78 degrees, which works out to 750grams/5 gallons) for my new 55g. I have been hoping to maintain the tank's Ca at somewhere between 400-450 ppm. Currently, with my Alk at 8, dosing 15ml of 2 part B-ionic every day for the last month. My Ca measures 365ppm, which is lower than what I was expecting.

I have two buckets that I recently purchased through F&S, so I decided to do a 5g test batch with both:

Bucket "A" Results:

5 gallons @ 1.026 sg
78 degrees, 11 KH and 8.32 ph.
Ca = 325ppm. (Elos)

Bucket "B" Results:

5 gallons @ 1.026 sg
78 degrees, 11 KH and 8.38 ph.
Ca = 350ppm. (Elos), 345ppm (Salifert)

These Ca results seem really low for a "Reef" blend. I was expecting something between 375-425.

I've read some threads over at RC (http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1265348&perpage=25&pagenumber=1) where other people who have bought Reef Crystals recently from F&S are having the same problem. F&S is once again bending over backwards to offer new buckets to dissatisfied customers, but the manufacturer is not saying anything. One person contended that they always get a 425ppm reading from Reef Crystals and didn't believe the complaints until he bought a bucket himself and confirmed the problem.

My goal is to get my calcium up, and I am not sure if getting yet another bucket of Reef Crystals is going to do the trick. Perhaps I should go to another salt?

I was wondering what TR Reef Crystal users normally see for Ca from their batches, and what recommendations anyone has for me. Should I simply increase my B-ionic dosing? Should I be dosing my SW batches with B-ionic?

Oh yeah. Perhaps I should mention a few more things in case the are relevant.

I am still fairly new to mixing my own salt (3 months), and I have been adding the salt to the water before it has been raised to 78 degrees. In other words, I place 5g of the 68 degree water in the bucket, turn on the heater and powerhead, and then slowly add the salt a few minutes after. I let this mix overnight if not for 24 hours before use.

Thanks for the heads up! I just checked my reef at a little under 400ppm and my makeup water (from F&S Reef Crystals) is not even 360ppm. I used an API test kit.

I just picked up a couple buckets (Reef Crystals again) from the LFS so I will try those next time I mix.

The other relevant point is that I only mix to 1.025 sg. So slightly less material that I am putting in there.

I just finished mixing some Reef Crystals out of a bucket from the LFS. I'll test as soon as temp and salinity are right.

My goal is to get my calcium up, and I am not sure if getting yet another bucket of Reef Crystals is going to do the trick. Perhaps I should go to another salt?

You could go to another brand of salt but wait, what brand, what price and maybe have nothing better. I have some thoughts and experience on this dilemma.

In the old days, you know I'm from the old days, IO was one of the first salts available and became the standard, or at least the most popular, salt. It was formulated for FO tanks because we didn't know how to keep corals, etc, in a "reef" tank. So, the formula's calcium level when mixed properly came out at 350ppm by design. I heard that IO, formulated to produce 450ppm Ca, would be cloudy for hours. It had something to do with hobbyists wanting clear water instantly. So they found by mixing their formula to a Ca level of 350ppm, it would clear in minutes. Since it had no ill effects on the critters we could keep back then, they went with the 350ppm Ca formula. I don't know if that story is true but, it came from a reliable source in the industry.

Jump years forward when reefing became possible and 350ppm Ca wasn't acceptable anymore, the manufacturer, with refinements in available chemicals, increased the CA to mix at the sea water level level of 450ppm and called it "Reef Crystals". It was and still is a marketing ploy IMO. With the popularity of IO, they couldn't take a chance of losing market share so, the reformulated IO, ie, "Reef Crystals" was marketed as new and advanced, especially formulated to keep our more delicate critters alive and thriving. Ah yes and because of this they could charge a premium price, too. That's a marketing ploy, in my humble opinion.

Do you need to spend more money for a premium salt to keep your reefs healthy and balanced? NOT IN MY OPINION!!! This is my opinion based on 40 years experience exclusively using IO in marine aquariums. This is what I've learned, believe in and use today. IO is a fine salt mix. It's been around for ever and has proven itself time and time again. It just needs to be tweaked a bit when mixed. We all know to use RO/DI water. I add concentrated Ca to bring the IO mixed water to 450ppm. BINGO, I've got one of the best, least expensive, salt mixes, utilized by thousands, probably millions, of hobbyists around the world.

But the problem is a bit more complicated than just tweaking the mixed saltwater. Magnesium levels play a huge role in the balance of our systems and many hobbyists don't test and in fact don't have a clue about it's importance. Mag, Ca and Ph/Alk work together to "balance" the water's ability to hold Ca at levels our critters need to metabolize Ca and build bone structure. NSW has a Mag level of 1250ppm. When I discovered this and tested for the first time for Mag, my level was 850 and I could not keep my CA level above 350. I'd dose to 450 and with in hours the level was 350 and days later 325. When I slowly dosed the Mag up to 1250/1300, magically my Ca was easy to maintain at 450/500 for days. Dosing regular amounts of Ca then became the norm again.

I also have strong beliefs in additive brands. I've been into marine aquariums long enough to know there was a day when there were NO additives to add. Of course now days there are TOO MANY additives on the market. Many are worthless and unnecessary!!!

Over the years, I've tried every brand. Six years ago, the owner of Ocean's Blend gave me a gallon set of his 2 part additive. I have been "hooked" on it ever since. It has made a noticeable difference in the growth and color of my corals. If you are into Calcium reactors or pickling lime juice or any other source of Calcium, and you are satisfied with the results keep using what you got. But, if you have doubts about your system of Ca replacement I recommend highly you give Ocean's Blend 2 part a try. It is Superior to anything I've used. They also have the Mag you need in it's purest form.

Being a TR sponsor, I'll make TR members an offer. Buy the gallon set of Ocean's Blend 2 part additive and a gallon of Magnesium, bought and shipped together, and use it until it is empty. Dose it according to instructions, test for Ca, Mag, Ph and Alk regularly. If you are not happy with the results ship the empty containers back to me with a note why and I will refund your money. Why the gallon size? Because any thing smaller you may not see a difference. This stuff is great in my opinion. Here's the link...

Ocean's Blend additives (http://www.theculturedreef.com/additives.htm)

I hope this helped.

Great info Dick.

BTW, my new water tested at 450 this AM, but I've had this bucket a while, so it may have been made before the current issues.

I mixed another bath fro mthe bucket I got fro the LFS last week. It was at 400. With SG mixed to 1.0255. I would expect a little higher than that still better than 360. Does temperature affect Ca reading? This is just mixing at room temp. There was nothing about temperature in the test kit and I would not expect it to have much effect.

Oh yeah. Perhaps I should mention a few more things in case the are relevant.

I am still fairly new to mixing my own salt (3 months), and I have been adding the salt to the water before it has been raised to 78 degrees. In other words, I place 5g of the 68 degree water in the bucket, turn on the heater and powerhead, and then slowly add the salt a few minutes after. I let this mix overnight if not for 24 hours before use.

Your method is fine.

I'll also mention that a Ca level that stays at 340ppm, consistently, on a day-to-day basis, is far better than going from 450ppm on Monday down to 350ppm on Friday and then getting corrected all at once. The actual value hardly matters at all, as long as it's generally within the commonly accepted range and you do your best to keep it at that value all the time
eg. kalk drip with top off water or adding enough balanced 2-part solution to correct for exactly 1 day's worth of calcium uptake in your tank, each night.

Temperature affects the SpG which could affect the apparent Ca at a given SpG (more salt = more Ca). But, if I recall my chemistry properly, it is something like a reduction of 0.001 in SpG for every 10*F rise in temperature so the difference between room temperature and tank temperature would be negligible.

I mixed another bath fro mthe bucket I got fro the LFS last week. It was at 400. With SG mixed to 1.0255. I would expect a little higher than that still better than 360. Does temperature affect Ca reading? This is just mixing at room temp. There was nothing about temperature in the test kit and I would not expect it to have much effect.

I'd be happy with 400...:no:

As usual, F&S went out of their way to offer a solution for me (new salt or additive). I agreed to send some samples (which was not required), so they sent me a prepaid RMA label. They are also sending out enough C-balance(they do not carry b-ionic) to boost 160 gallons.

Another reason to do business wiith F&S...

Thanks all for the assistance!