Biocube 8, anyone?

[mikellini]

I just got one of these for 'early' Christmas and I was wondering if anyone else has one... What have you done for mods and aquascaping? Pics? I'll post some in the near future... I clipped the plastic in between chamber 1 and 2 to increase the flow and distribute it across the chamber, as I've taken out the bioballs. Other than that, no mods as of yet, although I'm thinking about swapping out the stock pump for a MJ 600 or a Rio...

[poppin_fresh]

Congrats on the new nano...

I would hold off on the power head switch until you get the tank rolling. You might want to add a small pump for more circulation depending on what you want to keep. Buying a bigger pump and running all the flow through the back chambers may cause issues.

[PhotoJohn]

you could just add a good powerhead. I know its not a cool mod but it will increase flow in a easy effective way

[CarmieJo]

I have the stock pump in my NC24 and added a powerhead in the display.

[fat walrus]

It would be better to add a small powerhead rather than to upgrade the return pump. Increasing flow in almost any aquarium is a good thing, but increasing flow through a filtration area may be counterproductive.

[mikellini]

I want to switch out the stock return pump for a number of reasons...

1. The stock pump is quite noisy.
2. I've heard from many others that it is unreliable and has failed at inopportune times.
3. The display in this little tank is roughly 8x10x10, and adding a powerhead would greatly intrude on the all-in-one look of this nano (even a Koralia nano, I've seen it done in a few pictures).
4. Right now, I haven't decided on filtration in the back chambers. I have removed the bioballs and haven't yet used the stock filter cartridge. I'm thinking about possible making a small refugium out of the second chamber, but I may just put a bag of chemipure elite or some other such adsorbant in there. Alternatively, I could either make of buy a protein skimmer to go in that chamber. Others have put 2x2 chunks of LR in there for added filtration, so that may be an option as well. But in any case, I'm not sure an increase of 60-100 gph of flow through the rear chambers will have an adverse effect....

Anyone else have a BC8?

[Phurst]

I have a BC12. I just drilled it last week and added a sump/fuge.

[mikellini]

you mean a BC14? Which chamber(s) did you drill? I never really understood adding a sump to an AIO, kind of defeats the purpose for me. How is it working so far?

[Phurst]

Oops, I meant a NanoCube, not a BioCube. It's been great so far. I really just liked the shape of the tank, even though it's not really an all-in-one anymore. Although the way it's set up, the rear filtration chambers still work as designed. The drain is in the 3rd chamber, as is the return, but it's plumbed THROUGH the 3rd chamber straight into the display.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e332/pearsonhurst/HPIM3872.jpg

[fat walrus]

I want to switch out the stock return pump for a number of reasons...

1. The stock pump is quite noisy.
I have a Bio-Cube 14, and a Bio-Cube 29, I do not find it noisy. I bought an 8 for my wife's neice and it is sitting on her her nightstand, I have not heard any complaints yet. Perhaps you are very sensitive to noise, or maybe it is not sitting properly...causing vibration or flutter?


2. I've heard from many others that it is unreliable and has failed at inopportune times.
I just phoned my LFS buddy and asked him about this. He said he must have sold over 100 Bio-Cube 8's and have not had a single defective pump. He is a good friend and have no reason to lie. He did say that he had a lot of problems with Cube Master's pumps failing.

One possible scenario that I can see is perhaps some people got sand or other abrasives into the pump chamber.


3. The display in this little tank is roughly 8x10x10, and adding a powerhead would greatly intrude on the all-in-one look of this nano (even a Koralia nano, I've seen it done in a few pictures).
I understand, the concern that I would have is the increase suction forces through the intake slots. Secondary concerns would be the compromise of filtration with excessive flow through the chambers.


4. Right now, I haven't decided on filtration in the back chambers. I have removed the bioballs and haven't yet used the stock filter cartridge. I'm thinking about possible making a small refugium out of the second chamber, but I may just put a bag of chemipure elite or some other such adsorbant in there. Alternatively, I could either make of buy a protein skimmer to go in that chamber. Others have put 2x2 chunks of LR in there for added filtration, so that may be an option as well. But in any case, I'm not sure an increase of 60-100 gph of flow through the rear chambers will have an adverse effect....
It is not just the flowrate increase, as that is factored into the entire volume of the Bio-Cube, but the turnover ratio in that small compressed area of the chamber.

Will pods and other things tolerate such flow.

Will water have enough contact time with certain filtration media?

Will excessive particulates make it's way into the pump chamber, causing mechanical failure? (Hmmmmm..........maybe that brings us back to your point 2.

[mikellini]

I thought that it might not have been sitting properly, so I took it out and looked at it, cleaned it a little, and placed it back in a n umber of positions, ensuring the suction cups were adhering properly, and it still makes a rattling noise. I've heard of the same thing in a number of other posts on Reef Central an Nano-Reef.com... Also have heard of the pump failing on numerous occasions...

Can you explain why the increased suction through the intakes would be a concern? I'm not sure I follow you...

As for the excessive flow through the filter chambers, it's really only going up 1.6x the flow from the baseline... Will this make a huge difference? Maybe, depending on what I use for filtration. Remember, I have trimmed the slot that funnels the water to the back of the first chamber, and this allows for more even flow through the second chamber (and eliminates the option of using the trickle filtration with the bioballs)... Possible a little too much for a refugium, but definitely not too much for chemical filtration or a skimmer.

Thanks for your reply, you've got me thinking for sure!

[PhotoJohn]

with my tank a 24nano I figured the engineers for JBJ knew best and just went with their design and havent had any problems. Tanks are usually build for good functioning and why mess with something that has been tested and proven to work? just a thought

[fat walrus]

I thought that it might not have been sitting properly, so I took it out and looked at it, cleaned it a little, and placed it back in a n umber of positions, ensuring the suction cups were adhering properly, and it still makes a rattling noise. I've heard of the same thing in a number of other posts on Reef Central an Nano-Reef.com... Also have heard of the pump failing on numerous occasions...
I'm not there to hear it, so I take your word for it. That is why I like to shop at my LFS. In this scenario, the owner would have simply pulled a pump from another unit and I would go home with it to see if it made a difference. If it did not, he would troubleshoot with me to see if the noise was indeed the fault of the pump or some other factor. He would even lend me a pump of another brand to see if it made a difference.


Can you explain why the increased suction through the intakes would be a concern? I'm not sure I follow you...
1) Feeding may require a pump shutdown because the food is pulled into the slots too quickly. Off course the pump can be turned off, but I do not like to turn magnetic pumps on and off, the wear and tear besides for the mystery of whether they will turn back on or not.

2) Small fish, crabs, and shrimps getting too close and being pulled in.

3) Snails and anenomes walking across being pinned down.......


As for the excessive flow through the filter chambers, it's really only going up 1.6x the flow from the baseline... Will this make a huge difference? Maybe, depending on what I use for filtration. Remember, I have trimmed the slot that funnels the water to the back of the first chamber, and this allows for more even flow through the second chamber (and eliminates the option of using the trickle filtration with the bioballs)... Possible a little too much for a refugium, but definitely not too much for chemical filtration or a skimmer.

Thanks for your reply, you've got me thinking for sure!
1) Say you have a tank that is 10 gallons in overall volume and the filter chamber is 1 quart of the overall total of 10 gallons.

2) Say it comes with a pump that is rated at 100 gallons a hour. That means in the overall volume, (100gph/10) you are getting 10X turnover. But because the 1 quart filter chamber is in line with the pump, (100gph/.25) it is getting a 25X turnover.

3) Say now you upgrade to a pump that is rated at 160gph, for a flowrate increase by 1.6X

Now your 10 gal overall gallons increase in flowrate from 100gph to 160gph have increased by a percentage 62.5%, but the flowrate through the 1 quart filter chamber has increased by 640%.

[mikellini]

I see what you mean, but I have to disagree. The filter chamber in the Biocube 8 has to be at least a gallon, probably more like 2... and yes, there would be a substantial increase in the flow through that chamber, but it would still only be flowing 1.6 times faster than before. This would still be more than acceptable for a product like Chemipure or for a skimmer (which I'm starting to think wouldn't be a great option either).

I wish I had a good LFS around here. Unfortunately, the Biocube 8 at our only LFS in Fort McMurray is priced at $280, and I got this one in Edmonton (5 hours from here) for $160. I suppose I could send the pump back to them, and they are a pretty good LFS, so I'd probably get a replacement fairly quickly, but I'm looking at increasing the flow anyway, so it would just be a big waste of everyone's time and money.

As for the increased flow through the grates, I see what you mean here too. Only thing is, I'm not looking to stock with fish, and certainly not an anemone. I was thinking about some non-photosynthetic corals, and the feeding could become an issue. In that case, I'd just turn off the pump. I think even if I kept the stock pump, I'd have to turn it off though, so there you go I guess...

PhotoJohn: I used to think the same way as you: if it ain't broke, don't break it yourself. However, when I learned some of the reasoning behind the manufacturers designs, I started to realize why it might work for the majority of people, but wouldn't work for me. You see, the vast majority of people who want a small, desk-type all-in-one saltwater tank are looking to buy a "Nemo". For the purpose of keeping fish, a wet-dry trickle filter is a great solution. Fish can tolerate much higher levels of dissolved nitrate in the water without showing any ill effects; however many sessile invertebrates cannot. Since I'm not planning on having any fish, and exclusively corals, water quality is of much greater concern, and to this end, I am making modifications to the stock filtration that are designed to achieve pristine water quality. One of the best ways to do this (as far as I know) is to set up a macroalgae refugium that will use up excess nitrates in the water. There are other ways, such as chemical adsorbants, some corals (Xenia for example) and protein skimming (to remove organic compounds before they break down into nitrates), and all of these work with the natural process of denitrification via LR and LS to keep nitrates to a minimum. What it's going to come down to is what will work the best in a small tank such as the BC8.

[fat walrus]

I see what you mean, but I have to disagree. The filter chamber in the Biocube 8 has to be at least a gallon, probably more like 2... and yes, there would be a substantial increase in the flow through that chamber, but it would still only be flowing 1.6 times faster than before. This would still be more than acceptable for a product like Chemipure or for a skimmer (which I'm starting to think wouldn't be a great option either).
I was using an example to show disparity of flow increase between overall tank volume and an impacted small area.

You cannot factor in the prefilter chamber and the pump chamber as part of the overall factor. It is what we refer to a tunnel effect. The filtration compartment we are referring to is the middle chamber between the prefiltration chamber where the mechanical cartridge is and the end stage chamber where the return pump resides. Any argument beyond that is disengenious and is based on selective avoidence of mathematical equations.


I wish I had a good LFS around here. Unfortunately, the Biocube 8 at our only LFS in Fort McMurray is priced at $280, and I got this one in Edmonton (5 hours from here) for $160. I suppose I could send the pump back to them, and they are a pretty good LFS, so I'd probably get a replacement fairly quickly, but I'm looking at increasing the flow anyway, so it would just be a big waste of everyone's time and money.
I don't know your situation, but it seems if you try to buy locally, perhaps you will end up with a good LFS. My LFS never seems to think it is a big waste of their time.


As for the increased flow through the grates, I see what you mean here too. Only thin[/quog is, I'm not looking to stock with fish, and certainly not an anemone. I was thinking about some non-photosynthetic corals, and the feeding could become an issue. In that case, I'd just turn off the pump. I think even if I kept the stock pump, I'd have to turn it off though, so there you go I guess...
So once again I say that magnetic pumps were not designed to be turned off and on. Are you gonna be the guy the bitch about your 10 dollar pump that wont turn off even after being told that was not what it was designed to do?

[PhotoJohn]

I dont have water quality problems in my 24g nano and can grow any coral falling within the lighting requirments provided by the PCs. If you want good filtration and you are using LR then pulling biologicals into a filter really really fast to rot isnt going to help you. Getting a skimmer is a nice way to filter and increase flow. I would focus on flow within the cube not through the filter. Another thought, if you are doing a coral only tank why are you so worried about nitrates...the coral arnt going to muck up the water enough to matter as long as you are doing the regular water changes...which you will have to do to replace trace mineral absorbed by the corals anyway.

[R. Deschain]

FW: I get the tunnel effect that you are talking about. But could you explain why you are taking chambers #1 & #3 out of the equation...

Also, would the decreased contact time with the filter media be offset by the increased volume of water passing through per given time?

[CarmieJo]

Mike, the other problem with adding to your return pump is that you are going to have laminar flow.

[mikellini]

Well, I ordered a MJ 600 (160 gph), a bag of Chemi-Pure Elite, and a heater. I'm thinking of sticking the adsorbant into the second chamber, heater in the third. It'd be great to find a skimmer that would work in the first chamber, but for now I'll leave it open.

[V]

hmmm, had to be on holidays when this thread heated up didn't i , sheesh!

[ITeach2Wheels]

Hi Everyone, I just found this thread and forum so be patient with me. I have been trying to catch up with the podcasts...up to #80? I think?

Any how I tend to be a lurker, but since I saw this thread i thought I would reply.

I set up my BC in Oct.

These are my mods so far:

Removed filter, replaced with heater, 2 LR pieces and carbon bag, removed bottom grate for cleaning of chamber bottom.

Opened flow to chamber 2, removed bio balls and placed filter floss on top of defuser plate.
Made second chamber into fuge with cheato and piece of LR to hold down bottom grate.
Made home made fuge light. Attached to back of tank with velcro. Running on alternate cycle from main lights.

Changed pump to maxi-jet 600 (got good deal), added hydor-flow to display.

I have about 8# of LR with around 2" of sand.

So far, I am very happy with this setup. I have huge population of pods and my corals are doing very well.

I have a frog spawn, birds nest, candy cane, Star Polyp colony, 2 leathers, 2 mushrooms and lots of zoa and button frags and lots of individual polyps that are starting to divide. My Star polyps have more than doubled in size.

I will post pics as soon as I figure out how to do it..

Also this is my first salt water tank.

[CarmieJo]

Hi ITeach2Wheels and :welcome: to TR.

It sounds like you have been very busy with your tank! I'd love to see some pix of your tanks and of the mods you've made.

[mikellini]

Very interesting. I like what you've done, and I second the request for pics! I might just post some of my own as well...
You mentioned that you put some filter floss on top of the water diffuser for the stock bioballs... I had done this for a while, but I noticed that most of the water was not actually going through the filter floss, but instead flowing around it. To fix this, I cut pieces of filter floss that were a little bit larger that the chamber, and I removed the diffuser and put the filter floss in its place. It stays put because of the plastic ridges designed to hold the diffuser, and this way all of the water has to go through the floss.

PICSPICSPICS!

[ITeach2Wheels]

Thanks for the reply! I had the same problem with the filter floss. So, I took the aerator attachment from my powerhead (pipe "t" , hose, and end piece) and put it through the grate as an air bleed. I just needed to make a small whole to make it work. It can't believe the difference. If anything, the water flows to fast now! I also removed my bio balls and replaced the with cheato.

[ITeach2Wheels]

Oh...I am uploading pics to Photobucket right now.

[ITeach2Wheels]

Here is a couple for now...
http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj284/poppashaw/IMG_0804.jpg,
Pic of my slightly munched worm
http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj284/poppashaw/IMG_0808.jpg

[Phurst]

Wow, VERY nice looking!

[poppin_fresh]

If I could have managed to keep my Biocube 14 looking that good I would probably still have water in it. Keep up the good work!

[ITeach2Wheels]

It's not all roses. I had a pair of very young clowns, as well as an arrow crab and peppermint shrimp. I was using a Red Sea testing kit to check my parameters. Apparently, unless the pH is way off, every test is 8.0. So...although the pH was low it stayed stable.

What I didn't realize was the pH was dropping lower and lower and worse at night. I am not sure what started the slide. I did lose my first peppermint. I assume he died and was eaten by my nasarius snail. About a month later, my large (3/4") clown disappeared, overnight. He was fine in the afternoon, he ate well that morning. I lost my small (1/2") clown a couple af days later. After that, I took a water sample to my LFS for a test. The parameters were off, but with two dead fish that was to be expected. The PH was 7.5. I dosed with buffer and did several water changes of over a gallon. Unfortunately, it was to late for the peppermint and arrow crab. The snail tried to get them too, but I beat him to it. Now, three weeks after this all started everything is back to normal. I even brought home an electronic PH meter to make sure it doesn't happen again.

Any body have better luck with other test kits? I really don't trust my Red Sea anymore.

Here are some pics before the problem:
http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj284/poppashaw/IMG_0693.jpg,
http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj284/poppashaw/IMG_0686.jpg,
and a tank shot,
http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj284/poppashaw/IMG_0716.jpg

[CarmieJo]

That is a beautiful nano size reef.

[ITeach2Wheels]

That is a beautiful nano size reef.

Thank you so much, This is the first forum I have really participated in. ;)

I can't believe how much I enjoy watching everything interact and grow. I can't wait for my frags and polyps to become actual colonies.

Then....I will need a larger tank for the pair of clowns I got yesterday. :D

Finally the clowns and the cool tank mean my wife will want a bigger tank too! :up:

[CarmieJo]

It is great to have you here. I am on several forums but TR is my home. People here will tell you their opinion and they will tell you if you are doing something wrong. For instance, if the next pix you post of your tank has a blue tang in it we are going to tell you that this fish grows to be longer than your tank and that even though it is a tiny baby now it will be stressed out and does not belong in the BC8. But nobody will call you an idiot fish hater and suggest that you be drawn and quartered!

[ITeach2Wheels]

I think that's what I noticed when I started lurking here. I have also spent time on RC as well as the RC page for the Chicago area. Unfortunately there is really to much drama for it to feel like "home".

I do have a question...

I have been offered an "old" reef setup. I have a list of what is there, I am just trying to find out what would be a fair price. It is a relative of my wife....so I can't screw her, I just would like to know a fair price.

Which forum would you recommend as the best to list what is there and ask for opinion on what it would be worth. I was thinking the general discussion?

[CarmieJo]

I think the General Discussion would be just fine.

[ITeach2Wheels]

Cool! Thanks!