How do I make a sump?

[texasfootball21]

I want to start a 36 gallon corner as my first marine tank. I would like to put a 10 gallon sump in the stand.

What do I need?

I have a pump but I know very little about it. It is made by Little Giant and seems powerful, but what do I know about pumps? I found it in a bag of old aquarium stuff.

Can I make a basic sump with just a tube with a syphon sending water into a ten gallon and then the pump I have putting the water back into the tank?

Or how do I make it?

[dmccoy26]

A sump is just a storage place for additional water, so yes a syphon down and pump it back up would work fine.

[texasfootball21]

Thanks.
Do I need anything else?
I have read that the pump will automatically adjust to the flow of the siphon. Is this true?

[JustDavidP]

Nope... the pump will pump at the same rate, until it gets grungy, or impeded by something OR is torqued down with a ball valve or other valve of sorts. You need to ensure that your overflow is designed/built and rated for a compatible gallons per hour to match your pump.

Water will overflow or siphon from an overflow tube/box into the sump. The pump will send it back up to the tank. If the pump is super strong, and outcompetes the overflow box/siphon whatever... you will overflow your display tank.

If the pump is underpowered as compared to the overflow, your sump will overflow until it gets to the point of breaking siphon, or emptying an overflow box.

Dave

[Phurst]

Dave is right, you need to match your overflow and pump. Be sure to use an actual overflow, not just a piece of tubing as a siphon. An overflow will not only skim the surface of the water, but also help prevent your sump overflowing by breaking the siphon when the water in the display tank gets too low.

[dmccoy26]

You go by the headloss rating and not the actual pump rating to match the overflow rate, correct?

[texasfootball21]

Thanks.

So I will need an overflow? I was hoping I could get by with just a tube or some PVC pipe.
And because I need to know the power of my pump, I need to buy a new one?

[Phurst]

I would very strongly reccomend you use an overflow. Depending on what overflow you buy, and what pump you have you may be fine. We can probably figure out the GPH rating if you tell us what pump you have. The good thing about using an overflow, is it will help balance out the overflow/return cycle. Partricularly if the pump is rated under what the overflow is. The overflow works by siphoning out water that spills over into the overflow box, so as water is pumped into the tank, it overflows the surface skimmer, into the overflow box in the tank and is siphoned out. It's much harder to flood either the tank or sump using one.

[JustDavidP]

An overflow need not be a box either. If you can get the tank drilled, you can do something like this:

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d176/JustDavidP/overflow2.jpg

Though, in my opinion, if you drill, and go through that trouble, you should build an overflow box. They are much more efficient at surface skimming. They are NOT hard to build and install. Here's one I just built:

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d176/JustDavidP/oflowbox1.jpg

Then you can drill the bottom (if not tempered) or side and build a durso stand pipe. I drilled the lower side on this tank:

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d176/JustDavidP/drilled.jpg

And built the standpipe like this:

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d176/JustDavidP/DursoSectioned.jpg

Dave

[CarmieJo]

Nice explanation Dave. TX there should be a model # on that Little Giant that should help us to ID it.

[Phurst]

An overflow need not be a box either. If you can get the tank drilled, you can do something like this:

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d176/JustDavidP/overflow2.jpg









Hey David, can I get a shot of the back side of this bulkhead? I'm looking to do somthing similar.

[JustDavidP]

Hey David, can I get a shot of the back side of this bulkhead? I'm looking to do somthing similar.

Sure... ask and thy shall receive:

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d176/JustDavidP/durso.jpg

Dave

[JustDavidP]

The strainer and elbow inside the tank, flow to the external pipe outside. I made the pipe tall-ish and drilled with an air hole to stop the "slurping". It then flows down to the sump below. The black fitting you see in the forefront is a return nozzle.

D

[Phurst]

Perfect, thanks Dave!

[JustDavidP]

For what it's worth, this is the sump underneath. It's just 4 gallons, but allows me to put the heater, skimmer, etc. below the tank. It also allows me to dose kalk or whatever I need to do, and keep it from causing huge swings in the display.

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d176/JustDavidP/Sump1-1.jpg

Eventually, the tank that will sit in the place of the bowfront, will be plumbed through the floor into the 75G sump in the basement.

D

[clownfish4me]

oh how i wish i had a basement!:) what posibilitys...

[dmccoy26]

i agree clownfish4me.. not to many basements in texas.

[JustDavidP]

Yeah :) Basements are a good thing!

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d176/JustDavidP/fishroom1.jpg
http://s35.photobucket.com/albums/d176/JustDavidP/?action=view&current=fishroom1.jpg

[lReef lKeeper]

man, now i gotta get a basement !! my fish room is just to SMALL !!

[CarmieJo]

man, now i gotta get a basement !! my fish room is just to SMALL !!
Just jack the house up and add one. :)

[Astrivian]

Shoot, i am already in the basement. Anyone have a jackhammer i can rent and a backhoe so i can add another basement :)

Hey Texas, what are you planning on putting in your sump? Are you thinking of doing a refugium (LR, macroalgae, etc.) or just a place to have extra water and heaters (like in Dave's pic)?

When building the sump for my 100 gallon, i went through three variations before i finally got it right. Be prepared to flood your floor a couple of times. I had 75 gallons of salt water flowing out of the electrical sockets downstairs (this is when the tank was upstairs, hence the move to the basement :) )! Not a situation i recommend.

A friend of mine has a similar set up to what i think you are describing. He did add a refugium (sort of) by putting a smaller hex tank inside the larger rectangular one. The hex is filled with sand (DSB) and all of the water flows directly on top of this sand. He then lets the water overflow the hex into the bigger tank, where he has his heaters and return pump. It works quite well. Also, he has an overflow box with a siphon (like in robs video) and has not had any trouble with it. However, i agree with Dave here, if you can drill your tank, go for it.

Can you post pics of your set up?

[texasfootball21]

I changed my mind. I went with a 20 gallon high for my first tank. I still have the 36 and plan on setting it up soon. I want to keep some kind of macroalgae and LR in the fuge to keep water quality good. I think I may just go with a "fuge tube" like the one in the video (which was great by the way). I don't think I can post pictures sorry.

[Astrivian]

Hehe

The legend of the tube fuge lives on.

[CarmieJo]

Tx,

Are you having trouble posting pix? Have you tried uploading them to photobucket? Then you just copy the img code and paste it into your post.

[Pinecone_Jeff]

Hehe

The legend of the tube fuge lives on.Dude, I'm still gonna do a tubefuge when I get my new tank started. I think it's just such a great idea! You can get a crypitic fuge going with so little space needed. I mean, why not!

Also, I was thinking about the power outtage problem you mentioned in the video. What if the tubefuge lived in the sump and the rocks were stuck in there at the same level as the water. There's no need for a bottom cap. A pump can still pump water into the tube, this time from the top. And when/if the power goes out, the rocks and the water in the tube won't go cold too quickly as they'll be in the same volume of water as the sump. A little extra added insulation from volume. And heck, why not go with a really big pipe for a bigger cryptic tubefuge or a series of tubes for a bank of 'em, provided your sump is big enough.

Sorry, I kinda derailed this thread a bit.