Continuing from this thread:http://www.talkingreef.com/forums/new-saltwater/3965-water-change-during-cycle.html


Rock cycling testing/experiment

I'm looking for input on setting up a control tank and number of tanks you would suggest using.

The objective being to learn or look at what is the quickest most efficient way to cycle Dry or Base rock And maybe more importantly what causes a cycle to go slow or not at all.


I haven’t given this any serious thought yet but just thinking out loud,
I’m thinking maybe 6x15 gallon tanks on a rack system getting the same light
All set up with the same amount of rock by weight and of similar size
All seeded with the same amount of sand or rock from the same system

1) gets no water changes
2) gets one 100% water change at 1 week
3) gets one 10% water change at 1 week

etc … open to input maybe NSW changes vs synthetic

I would monitor weekly progress of each and record the weekly results.
and maybe say at 5 weeks hit them with X grams/ gallon ammonia nitrate to see which handles it best/ fastest.

I’d appreciate your help and input

(BTW Dave and Gustavo…I have beer on set up day ;) )

The control tank is easy - no water changes until NH3 & NO2 are at zero. Would you do one water change of varying amounts on the other tanks or would you also vary the frequency of water changes? I think the idea of a challenge at 5 weeks is good. You may have to play a bit with the challenge first in an established tank to have a benchmark.

CarmieJo,
Good point on the benchmark, however finding someone willing to dump a couple of teaspoons of ammonia nitrate into their established tank might be a tall order.:no:

I've spoken with the biologists down at Fritz on a few occasions and they have some hard figures of x grams per gallon = x PPM ammonia.
Maybe we could forego the established tank benchmark and just measure time for level x to -0- ?
We could set level x at a number that is widely accepted as unsafe for fish.

A couple of other test tanks might include:

Fritz dosed (I'd be interested in this because it's a product I use)
sugar dosed ?
Vodka dosed?

Well maybe not in MY tank. I was thinking more of an established tank of cured rock. But I really think that dosing the ammonia and measuring reduction time would give you a more real life scenario.

If you were going to experiment with the other parameters would you do it concurrently with the water changes or subsequent to the water change experiment? Bare bottom tanks?

I used to use Fritz products back when I lived in OH but no one here carries them so I'm no longer familiar with their products. Is it a cycle accelerator?

ok guys, i know the rock things inportant here, but in reality we're talking about the bactera and the varations that influence its effectivness. Now in our case, this dictates efficency on any given surface thats collonised.

id suggest small cubes, 500ml each, one frag plug each weighed & molded the same for each holding vessile. the pumps has to be the same model as well.
For today expernment id kill off the idea of NSW vs synthetics, thats a whole other experinment that can be done latter. id place all the vessiles on a rack insulated by foam walls individually and have a closed loop vessile plumbed in to each, pre set at various temp levels.
Id go target specific bactera for the cause. and dose accordingly.
you could then control the bio-load with your ammonia drops on a schedual. just a thought.

Veriann,
I understand what you are saying but think of yourself as a newbie for just a minute. You just laid out youR thousand(s). What's the most important question on tour mind? Fish! how quick? how many? I answer that question all day "fish, fish we want more fish, quick fish, lots o fish and big fish.

Carmie,
BB vs ssb or dsb is interesting, I think I'd lean toward ssb for a couple of simple reasons:
a SB is a much more common set up
sand from an existimg system is a great and simple way to "seed"
I think SSB is more practican than DSB in this application

Now, that said maybe one tank could be BB seeded only with LR?

sounds like this could be a great study..
id be willing to publish the results in Reefreaders

a lot of details to work out, but i like the idea

I agree that LS is a great way to seed a tank. I guess I was thinking BB because it is easy to control. SSB using sand by weight could also be presumed to be equal. Measuring by depth would be harder to control since it would be nearly impossible to have an equal amount in each tank.

No rock or sand particle has the same weight to mass density, hence collonisations will be govened by too many factors out of you control.
I do see where your going with this though, so i'll sit back & watch now!

Hey I know a guy with a really nice room divider that may be willing to dump some of the that, what you call that thing :D?? Ammonia, into his tank, the thing is he will need to have couple o 30 packs ready because Dave and I will be there to help with the special occasion :D


Jokes a part, I like the Idea and if this will be long term study I'm more then happy to get involved, I will be setting up a 450g total water volume in about 5 months and I'm sure you know what kind of rock I will be using right?

Gustavo