Well, i know many of you, like myself, have been waiting for some competition in the LED lighting Market.. well its finally here. a new company has come out with a new fixture to compete in this new Market. I have previews the system and it looks to be very competitive with the existing products out there. It even has some nice extras that are new to the Market

First, i think its important that i note, this is not an advertisement or endorsement, i have not seen or used this product first hand (yet), but its exciting to me to see the new developments and wanted to start getting some discussion on this.

So if you have interest, check it out here:
http://www.aquaillumination.com/

and make sure you post your comments here, People for Aqua Illumination are TR members and supporters, and are watching this thread for your thoughts and idea.. take this chance to get involved first hand.. :)

Definitely looks like a system worth trying but will it still give that beautiful shimmer that we all know and love of Metal Halide Lighting Systems?

my understanding is that the LED systems will still give shimmer because they are point light sources, but because there are so many "points" its slightly washed out.

so its not as much as MHs, but more than fluorescence

Wouldn't it be great to combine the LED technology with the nanocubes! Think how the temp could be reduced be using these lights! I would go for a nanocube mod even.

Wouldn't it be great to combine the LED technology with the nanocubes! Think how the temp could be reduced be using these lights! I would go for a nanocube mod even.
actually that is a great suggestion, i am surprised it hasn't been done already, especially with all the heating issues the cubes have

Greetings:

We are actually very interested in the Nano Cubes. Our 12" unit would be ideal for a Nano Cube.

The current issue is making it fit on various tanks. I've searched google looking for the different sizes, and found that quite a few of them have an integrated cover/hood with the lighting built in.

If we could work with a tank company, I'd be willing to design an integrated solution using our lighting/control system.

Any suggestions on this would be great!

BR,
-Chris
Aqua Illumination - Key Devices, Inc.

Wouldn't it be great to combine the LED technology with the nanocubes! Think how the temp could be reduced be using these lights! I would go for a nanocube mod even.

i would LOVE to try out one of these setups !! i just can not justify, to the wife, spending all that money on a setup that is still somewhat "controversial" at keeping what i keep.

Chris, nanocustoms (http://www.nanocustoms.com/catalog/index.php) works with all sorts of mods for nanocubes that are already out of the market... including lights. They work with other companies as well such as the peeps who put of the sapphire skimmers.

Any ETA for this to be on the market?

Hi George,

We are actually in the testing phase; we'd like to get another 3-4 weeks to continue monitoring temperatures, light output, etc.

We also have a couple demo user sites that will be using the system over the next few months.

Our goal is to have it ready for sale once our testing phase is complete; we have already begun ordering/forecasting the long lead time items. Our current plan is to accept pre-orders early April, with delivery 4-6 weeks out. It'll likely be quicker than this for shipment, but we'd like to avoid stating a time frame we can't meet.

Pricing should following in the next few weeks as well.

We would like to be involved with the Talkingreef community, and we are very interested in your thoughts about the product. We want to know what features you like, what you don't, and what you'd like to see.

This will help out greatly as we get closer to a production product.

-Chris
AI - KD

Any ETA for this to be on the market?

Thanks Chris.

I'm no lighting expert when it comes to interpreting spectral intensity plots, but the ones on your web site would seem to be comparable to a 400w double ended MH bulb.

What intensity are you foreseeing these fixtures being comparable to?

Hi George,

We are actually in the testing phase; we'd like to get another 3-4 weeks to continue monitoring temperatures, light output, etc.
-Chris
AI - KD

Chris,

just out of curiousity, are you using the Luxeon 3W LED's or another type? I know many manufacturers are coming out with supre bright LED's, even at lower PD ratings.

Hello:

Thanks Chris.

I'm no lighting expert when it comes to interpreting spectral intensity plots, but the ones on your web site would seem to be comparable to a 400w double ended MH bulb.

What intensity are you foreseeing these fixtures being comparable to?

I'd say we're between a 250W and 400W. We'll release test data in the weeks to come - we have an independent source that will be testing it as well as our own tests. Actually, every unit will come with a per-foot graph showing PAR that was measured. We want you to know exactly what you've bought.

Chris,

just out of curiousity, are you using the Luxeon 3W LED's or another type? I know many manufacturers are coming out with supre bright LED's, even at lower PD ratings.

We are actually using two LEDs from Seoul Semiconductor. If you take a look at the 'Specs' page of our website, you'll see the part number and other info about it. The white LED has the highest lumens/watt of a production part. Luxeon announced a week or two ago that they have a new one that is slightly more efficient with great power handling, but it's suspected to be months, if not years out from production.

We may be incorporating another LED to the array depending on how the next few weeks of testing goes.

-Chris
AI - KD

I see that you'll be combining the lighting system with data acquisition. Do you guys have plans in the future to integrate more controls into the system that pH, ORB and temp?

...looking forward to seeing this technology develop!

Hello:

At the moment, our initial units will ship with the ability to monitor pH, ORP, and temperature. We have a serial port as well as an I/O port for expansion.

Our current focus is on the lighting fixture and baseline data acquisition hardware. The system is field upgradeable by the user. (As new features/fixes become available, you can reprogram the unit via the serial port)

Future products are still on the drawing board; power strips, additional probes, and sensors are just a few. We are interested in what you want. Let us know what you'd like to see.

-Chris
AI - KD


I see that you'll be combining the lighting system with data acquisition. Do you guys have plans in the future to integrate more controls into the system that pH, ORB and temp?

...looking forward to seeing this technology develop!

Chris, thanks for the quick follow ups and your commitment to the community, it helps build good faith in your company.. :)

and for everyone else, make sure you leave your comments or feedback while we have their attention.. :)

How about making it easy to mount in a hood
- Make it a little under the standard lengths
- Several venting options so that is not an issue depending on the hood

I'd be more interested in the economy version. I don't care about all the hookups or features beyond basic selection of color temperature, timer, and a gradual on and off period would be nice.

Hello:

NaClFinatic: Make it a little under the standard lengths

Our initial design actually had everything integrated into the end caps... while this was convenient for shipping, production, etc. it proved to be problematic for those with hoods. The 'end caps' of the fixture now only house the power connections (on one end) and the overall fixture width is about 1" less than stated to accommodate the hoods.

NaClFinatic: Several venting options so that is not an issue depending on the hood

We chose the top of the fixture for a couple reasons.
1) From the hoods we've looked at, one could hang the fixture from the top of the hood, and still maintain around 1" of clearance between the fan vent on the top of the fixture and the top of the hood.

2) Our goal is to have the unit as air tight as possible (without crazy amounts sealants) Putting the fans on the side not only makes clearance when placed in the hood a problem, but also is an easy path for salt water to sneak in.

NaClFinatic: I'd be more interested in the economy version. I don't care about all the hookups or features beyond basic selection of color temperature, timer, and a gradual on and off period would be nice.

We are trying to make this an economical purchase; especially when looked at in comparison to a metal halide over the lifespan of your tank. The 'hookups' and 'features' don't represent a large cost on the bill of materials. The LEDs, driving system, and fixture production are the largest cost. If we did remove it all and made an 'economy' version, I believe most people would spend the extra few (literally few) dollars and get the full featured version.

-Chris
AI - KD

How about making it easy to mount in a hood
- Make it a little under the standard lengths
- Several venting options so that is not an issue depending on the hood

I'd be more interested in the economy version. I don't care about all the hookups or features beyond basic selection of color temperature, timer, and a gradual on and off period would be nice.

I'm interested in a product like this, but I was wondering....what are the chances that this would allow such light demanding SPS corals to thrive? Can it really do the same job as MH?
I'd love the monthly energy savings, even if it means a bit more up front.

Hello:

As I said above, we've designed it to perform like a 250W - 400W metal halide, but the proof is in the test results.

I'd like to think that we can handle the demanding SPS corals, but I don't want to provide a definitive answer yet. I'm pleased with the testing so far...

We plan to have our own data released as well as initial third party data in the next couple weeks.

We will keep the board posted as new data becomes available.

-Chris
AI - KD

I'm interested in a product like this, but I was wondering....what are the chances that this would allow such light demanding SPS corals to thrive? Can it really do the same job as MH?
I'd love the monthly energy savings, even if it means a bit more up front.

I'm interested in a product like this, but I was wondering....what are the chances that this would allow such light demanding SPS corals to thrive? Can it really do the same job as MH?
I'd love the monthly energy savings, even if it means a bit more up front.
just to add to what Chris mentioned..
the existing LED lights are proving to work jsut fine for this.
the Solaris PFO fixtures have been tested and are currently performing as expected.
there are MANY informal reports like this one here
http://www.talkingreef.com/forums/lighting/2345-solaris-led-illumination-system.html?highlight=solaris

and then there is one formal analysis by Dana Riddle here
Advanced Aquarist's Online Magazine - Product Review: A New Horizon in Lighting: PFO's Solaris LED System (http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2006/8/review2)

It is also expected that Sanjay Joshi will be producing a report soon too since he has a test unit he is has been working with

Chris, I was thinking that some sort of API, query, or XML data dump from the monitoring system would be useful. Many units like the Aquacontroller 3 have a built in web server, but none that I have seen have a way of either programatically controlling the unit (most cool -- at least for a software developer) or dumping the data effectively to an alternate or larger database without submitting to the proprietary software that may be way more than you want or not what you need.

I understand vendors want people to get their products, but some level of embracing an open-source system would be sweet.

Hi George:

I agree with you; this would be nice to have. I will discuss this with our software team, and see what we can do.

We've discussed the application software, though our main focus is getting the lighting aspect of the fixture solid. Upgrades will be available on our website, and as I alluded above, the system will be upgradeable via the serial port on the controller.

We haven't discussed it much, but the unit will have a Bluetooth option which will allow you to partner your PC to the fixture and stream data back and forth. If we create an API, hopefully we can intrigue some software savvy enthusiasts to code application software.

An open-source system would be great; I'm a huge advocate of this approach. The downside of this approach is that it can intimidate those that want an 'out of the box' solution, which tends to be the majority on a product like this.

If this is the general consensus, or a group of programmers want to work with us on the development of a Windows and/or OSX app. let us know and we'll do what we can to accommodate you.

-Chris
AI - KD

Chris, I was thinking that some sort of API, query, or XML data dump from the monitoring system would be useful. Many units like the Aquacontroller 3 have a built in web server, but none that I have seen have a way of either programatically controlling the unit (most cool -- at least for a software developer) or dumping the data effectively to an alternate or larger database without submitting to the proprietary software that may be way more than you want or not what you need.

I understand vendors want people to get their products, but some level of embracing an open-source system would be sweet.

as long as it works on OS X everything else is a bonus.. :)

as long as it works on OS X everything else is a bonus.. :)

yeah...I second that! :D

A good API would be awesome so I can set up software or control it however I like. And along with that, your open source forum could soon offer some great options for anyone that wanted a ready made solution. You could then ship some of the best software offerings with future deliveries.

Hello:

OS X, eh? I'm still waiting for them to bring back OS 8. That was solid :)

We have a couple Mac users, so we should be able to do some development. Open-source of that project would be nice as we don't do a lot on that platform. (Last thing I programmed for a Mac was in REALbasic, which surprisingly is still around)

We'll keep you updated as we get more formalized data prepared to show; we'll also start a forum/Wiki to discuss this further.

-Chris
AI - KD

Chris, i just want to say its awesome the way you are involving the public.. i bet it will show in the final product... thanks

Wait, you can program on a Mac? According to those commercials with John Hodgeman and Justin Long, it comes with everything already. What's to program? :D:D

I keed! I keed! It's cute. It really is.

But seriously, the "lightweight web server" approach would cover all platforms in one shot, if you went that way. Custom programs could use a request-response type system for control and XML data returns would satisfy all platform data issues. Downside is that you trade out your multi-platform headache for increased module complexity. At this stage, you may be well beyond those sorts of changes to the system.

I'll be interested to see the software implementation.

But seriously, the "lightweight web server" approach would cover all platforms in one shot, if you went that way. Custom programs could use a request-response type system for control and XML data returns would satisfy all platform data issues. Downside is that you trade out your multi-platform headache for increased module complexity. At this stage, you may be well beyond those sorts of changes to the system.

????????


:unsure: :p

Hi George:

We actually made a decision yesterday to make a few changes:

* The controller and light fixture will no longer need to be purchased together. Based on what others have said regarding cost and necessity of features, we decided to separate the two devices in an effort to address these points.

The lighting fixture will have a USB port on it that will allow the average user to plug it into their PC, launch the control application and set the sunrise/sunset times, max intensity, and a few other items. For the power user, you will be able to leave the fixture plugged in to your PC and stream data back and forth to the device.

Bluetooth will also be an option in the fixture to 'cut the wires'.

* The controller/data acquisition system will be available separately and have a controllable power strip, as well as the other sensor options as discussed.

With regards to the software and its implementation, nothing is set in stone - we want the end user's input as we develop it so we can cater to your needs.

We'll have additional info as more solidifies - the lighting fixture itself will likely be available before the controller, but it'll shortly follow.

I'm open to the community's thoughts on this; please let me know what you think.

Best regards,
-Chris
AI-KD




But seriously, the "lightweight web server" approach would cover all platforms in one shot, if you went that way. Custom programs could use a request-response type system for control and XML data returns would satisfy all platform data issues. Downside is that you trade out your multi-platform headache for increased module complexity. At this stage, you may be well beyond those sorts of changes to the system.

I'll be interested to see the software implementation.

actually what george is getting at makes a lot of sense, and i would think would be easier to support and develop for...

instead of having a cable (or bluetooth) and fat client.. do it like many network appliances do.
the controller has a mini menu to change the IP (or leave it on DHCP by default) then have and RJ-45 ethernet port and/or wireless
it attaches to the network and then its accessible via a webpage.
using a static IP or a zero config protocol like bonjour would make this easier

but then the webpage has all of the programing settings and then also has output data. this way people could publish this existing web page to the internet if they want to (something MANY people go to great lengths to do).. nothing extra since its already there.. if the web page is built using back-end XML those files could then be downloaded VIA http or ftp for all the ubergeeks that want to play with it
but it seems like with a wireless/wires enabled network webserver you have everything we have been looking for. accessibility, no fat client, internet publishing, graphing, platform independent, upgradability (by uploading firmware files). none of this is new, this is how any network appliance works today..
the other nice thing is it should be a lot cheaper for you to add a wireless card than a bluetooth adapter, and more people are familiar with this.. not to mention faster transfer speeds.

i know i dont see the "big picture" but i dont see a downside (other than its a major direction change...lol)

Hi Rob:

I'm with you here...

Do you guys not like the idea of having USB or Bluetooth, and would rather Ethernet?

We've done devices like this in the past, but weren't sure if this is something that would be accepted (running Ethernet to your tank).

We could probably do an 802.11 version too... that's a bit out though.

If DHCP is acceptable we could do some sort of discovery mechanism. I'd like to avoid putting a display on the fixture if at all possible.

We'll discuss this internally and see what we can come up with - keep the input coming!

-Chris
AI - KD

actually what george is getting at makes a lot of sense, and i would think would be easier to support and develop for...

instead of having a cable (or bluetooth) and fat client.. do it like many network appliances do.
the controller has a mini menu to change the IP (or leave it on DHCP by default) then have and RJ-45 ethernet port and/or wireless
it attaches to the network and then its accessible via a webpage.
using a static IP or a zero config protocol like bonjour would make this easier

but then the webpage has all of the programing settings and then also has output data. this way people could publish this existing web page to the internet if they want to (something MANY people go to great lengths to do).. nothing extra since its already there.. if the web page is built using back-end XML those files could then be downloaded VIA http or ftp for all the ubergeeks that want to play with it
but it seems like with a wireless/wires enabled network webserver you have everything we have been looking for. accessibility, no fat client, internet publishing, graphing, platform independent, upgradability (by uploading firmware files). none of this is new, this is how any network appliance works today..
the other nice thing is it should be a lot cheaper for you to add a wireless card than a bluetooth adapter, and more people are familiar with this.. not to mention faster transfer speeds.

i know i dont see the "big picture" but i dont see a downside (other than its a major direction change...lol)

Sounds great! The USB and separate controller that is. The web interface would be nice too. But just having the USB and a PC app sounds great. I always wondered how hard the other LED lighting solution is to program with a little LCD and a couple buttons. It seems with all the options and possibilities, that the PC interface is practically a necessity for ease of use.

Ethernet would be even better than USB as as far as I'm concerned. A long ehternet cable would be much easer for someone to run than long USB cable.

wireless would require much more configuration and a little higher cost

wireless/wired would be similar work, wireless would only add the complexities if you are using WEP or WPA.

my thoughts are it would be easier to run a long Ethernet cable than get a PC close to my tank since there is a limit to the length of USB cables you can get. all my tanks are downstairs, where i have no close by computer. running a Ethernet cable would not be a big deal, but a USB cable? yeah, that would not be easy or even possible.

it would be even easier with wireless.. that said, i think the difference in wired or wireless is minor. most of the development at a high level is the same. the whole back end web delivery interface woudl be the same, only the controller hardware would need to be modified to accept the handle the wireless interface

personally, the less wires that I have to deal with in my tank room, the better off I am. I would opt for something wireless.

Is there a problem with doing Bluetooth? This would seem like the most advanced and simple way to do it....you could even send the info to your mobile if you don't want to lug your computer within range of your tank!

well thats the thing, wireless has a range that dwarfs bluetooth, its still easy to setup, more compatible (most computers come standard with wireless, many dont have bluetooth standard)
wireless would be easier and cheaper since its a more standard and widely adopted technology. everything you need from bluetooth you can get from wireless (except connection to a phone, which may not work with alot of phones anyways, and would require phone apps to get and receive the data from the controller unit, not to mention many phones will only connect to a headset

I think that range would be the issue with bluetooth. If your computer is in another part of the house it may not have the range to connect.

Wireless is OK but i would need to configure it to connect to my secured router.

Also I'm not sure if DHCP is that great. If you have a router DHCP is OK but you still have to find out which address it is to connect from the PC. If you dont have a router and would be just directly connecting from a PC then you would need DHCP server on your PC. But at the same time with an initial static IP you need to still know what it is and be in the same subnet... Like Rob said you need someway to initially configure it as needed for the connection. I guess this coudl be over USB. You could configure the fixture while attached to the PC then take it off to the fish room.

well, most network appliance allow you to setup the network IP, subnet, gateway, etc all using the little admin panel.. so that could be done here.. or if on DHCP, there could be a menu item that "shows Network IP" or something so you can see what it is

yeah, I get what you're saying Rob and of course, wireless has a longer range. I guess I just got confused when you were talking about running an ethernet cable through the house for your PC.....but, I guess that was because you don't have wireless in your house? or there's no range in the basement?

yea.. just to compare things...
it would be
USB vs ethernet - both wired Ethernet is more flexible and requires no fat client
bluetooth vs Wi-Fi - Wi-Fi has longer range more interoperability and no fat client,.

while there are obvious advantages its not really fair to cross compare them.. ;)
(ie.. USB vs Wi-Fi)

Hi Guys:

Ok... this is a good discussion.

Class 1 Bluetooth actually has pretty good range, but isn't nearly as robust as Ethernet of Wi-Fi.

Wi-Fi is probably not going to happen - at least on the fixture. The controller may may have it as an option, but 802.11 on an embedded system is significantly more complex than an x86 WinXP or OS X system. The hardware is expensive and the software alone would take months.

There are 'plug-n-play' options but they're pretty spendy and that's without the software.

We'll probably go static IP over DHCP; DHCP may be an option once setup. We have a limited amount of code space, so it's not like we can through IPv6 on there (ok, that's a bit extreme, but I'm trying to emphasis software efficiency is paramount)

The unit will broadcast until it's found and then one can set the IP, DHCP, or whatever.

A crossover cable may be an option too for initial setup.

We're still working out how this is going to work; going this route adds a good deal of complexity to the system and development time. I do agree with you guys that it would be ideal.

We'll still have Bluetooth as an option. Going this route is far more simplistic then Wi-Fi, and using a Class 1 module will give up to 100 meters (line of site) which is pretty impressive.

Keep up the input - at some point we should probably get a thread going at Reef Central so we can get more input regard this.

Best regards,
-Chris
AI - KD

thanks for the input chris, and thanks for taking our ideas..
i would like to state (even though im sure i dont need to) that none of these should hold up the current products.. i see these as ideas for future products..
maybe you sell the lights fixture as a base, then add on controllers that vary in what they can do.. with a combination of serial connection, usb, bluetooth, ethernet, wi-fi, etc.. then they can be purchased as desired.

Some thoughts on the networking discussion:

USB and Ethernet can be interchangeable given some low-cost adapter options. I can't speak for Macs, but on PC's, a USB device can be a network adapter as well. It would be really cool to implement USB, Ethernet, *and* Bluetooth.

IMO, from trying to mix-and-match wireless devices on 802.11b/g networks, I'd steer clear of non-Bluetooth wireless. It's a siren's song of range, but the "jagged rocks" is the compatibility issues with the various implementations of wireless security protocols. You'll be opening yourself to a deluge of customer service calls from people trying to get the device on a wireless network that's too new or too old or too proprietary.

This doesn't mean people can't go wireless. They'd just need to get a WAP device for the ethernet port or a wireless USB adapter for the USB port. Leave that end of hardware compatibility in their arena so they can buy one that matches their wireless router manufacturer.

On the static IP, I agree that's the best route. Many home networks don't broadcast all device names like a domain does which would make it difficult for software to connect since a restart of the router wouldn't guarantee the same IP again with DHCP. Plus, if a user simply wants to use a hub or a switch rather than a router, they have that option.

I think you should definitely have at least USB connectivity on the device. Virtually everyone has that connectivity on their computers, but not everyone has Bluetooth (though USB Bluetooth adapters are less than $20 -- perhaps include one that's been tested and true) and not everyone has a home network (and crossover cables is another support issue, IMO). However, the limitation of 5m is pretty rough. Personally, I'm a fan of the Ethernet option since my whole house is wired for 100Mbit in every room.

Hi George,

Very good points... I'll comment below.

USB and Ethernet can be interchangeable given some low-cost adapter options. I can't speak for Macs, but on PC's, a USB device can be a network adapter as well. It would be really cool to implement USB, Ethernet, *and* Bluetooth.

We could do USB, Ethernet, & Bluetooth... or at least leave Bluetooth as an optional purchase. I'm not sure if people would use the USB if they had the choice between it and Ethernet though. I'd like to avoid having options that 1 out of 20 people use, you know?

IMO, from trying to mix-and-match wireless devices on 802.11b/g networks, I'd steer clear of non-Bluetooth wireless. It's a siren's song of range, but the "jagged rocks" is the compatibility issues with the various implementations of wireless security protocols. You'll be opening yourself to a deluge of customer service calls from people trying to get the device on a wireless network that's too new or too old or too proprietary.

Totally agree here. The cost is significant - from a hardware and service side.

This doesn't mean people can't go wireless. They'd just need to get a WAP device for the ethernet port or a wireless USB adapter for the USB port. Leave that end of hardware compatibility in their arena so they can buy one that matches their wireless router manufacturer.

The USB port on the device wouldn't allow for device to be plugged into it; it'd be a USB device itself, not a host. An Ethernet to Wi-Fi bridge would be the way to go if this was the case, but I've had mixed results with those...

On the static IP, I agree that's the best route. Many home networks don't broadcast all device names like a domain does which would make it difficult for software to connect since a restart of the router wouldn't guarantee the same IP again with DHCP. Plus, if a user simply wants to use a hub or a switch rather than a router, they have that option.

Agreed - there'd be a default address, then it could be configured once accessed.

I think you should definitely have at least USB connectivity on the device. Virtually everyone has that connectivity on their computers, but not everyone has Bluetooth (though USB Bluetooth adapters are less than $20 -- perhaps include one that's been tested and true) and not everyone has a home network (and crossover cables is another support issue, IMO). However, the limitation of 5m is pretty rough. Personally, I'm a fan of the Ethernet option since my whole house is wired for 100Mbit in every room.

Bluetooth has become pretty robust as its matured. If we could recommend or supply a USB-Bluetooth adapter with cross-platform support I think this would be fine.

We could have USB, Ethernet, and Bluetooth - it really comes down to cost. Personally I'd choose Ethernet or Bluetooth, as the 5m limit would be a problem. The software to get it (USB) to emulate a network device would be rather tasking as well. The Bluetooth would actually be considered a serial port on the system, so application programs would simply call the port. Ethernet would be hands down the easiest way for application software to be developed.

At this moment, I'm inclined to having Ethernet jack standard with Bluetooth as an option. USB is doable, but I'm not sure if it'd be as widely used as the Ethernet.

-Chris
AI - KD

maybe the idea of having 1 or 2 USB hosts ports.. like expansion ports..
then people could add what they want in an al-a-carte method
if i want bluetooth i add that part, if i want ethernet.. you get the point..

would this be harder or easier than building then in? is it more expensive?

just tossing out idea..

the only thing i continue to say is that an IP based webserver is the best route IMHO.

Hi Rob,

This is a cool idea, but would require us to bump up microprocessors to something with closer to the power of a cell phone and then we'd be looking at running Linux, WinCE or some other RTOS. The hardware alone would be 3-4 times the cost of what we're working with now.

We've discussed this for in the future, but this would require thousands of man hours of work.

I think for now the IP based system will be the route we go - it'll allow us to do it rapidly and not raise the cost of the unit.

-Chris
AI - KD

maybe the idea of having 1 or 2 USB hosts ports.. like expansion ports..
then people could add what they want in an al-a-carte method
if i want bluetooth i add that part, if i want ethernet.. you get the point..

would this be harder or easier than building then in? is it more expensive?

just tossing out idea..

the only thing i continue to say is that an IP based webserver is the best route IMHO.

Thanks chris.. i figures it would be more.. ;)

yeah, i think cabled ethernet and a little webserver would be perfect..
and actually, i think it would be the first of its kind on the market..

all of the existing controllers out there, use ugly fat client interfaces and require a certain level of "geeky-ness" to get them running at full potential. if you did it with a web page i think you would open it up to more people and have a GREAT new item to add to the marketing pitch.. :)

and like i noted before.. one thing people always want, and go to great lengths to hack together is email notification, internet accessible stats, and pretty graphs. if you do this with a slim version of apache and php you could have it all there right out of the box

Hi all:

We were discussing our interface options yesterday, and had a few questions for you guys:

* Will an Ethernet interface be beneficial considering the light only needs to be set and then allowed to run its cycle? Since we're eliminating the outboard controller as a standard item, that would eliminate the data acquisition and the need to stream data back and forth.

* Would USB or serial be acceptable for this instead?

* If we put a simple display on the end cap (as we've done on our early designs), would that be adequate for the setup of the day/night cycle, intensity, color, etc.?

We want to make sure it's easy for our users, but not overkill. We plan on building a controller as complete product, which seems like a more appropriate place for the Ethernet port.

Please let me know what your thoughts...

Thanks,
-Chris
AI - KD

USB (or serial, though serial ports may soon or already be fading away on cheaper computers) would be just fine as far as I'm concerned. Even a simple on device panel is ok for me to program the lights. Does it have battery backup to maintain the clock in a power failure?

It'd be more likely to be USB, than serial for the reason you stated.

Either way it'd have a battery backed up clock.

-Chris
AI - KD

USB (or serial, though serial ports may soon or already be fading away on cheaper computers) would be just fine as far as I'm concerned. Even a simple on device panel is ok for me to program the lights. Does it have battery backup to maintain the clock in a power failure?

As far as I am concerned if all you need to talk to the computer for is initial programing USB would be just fine. Would it be possible to make the processor (or whatever it would be called) in the light something that would be easy to pop off? That way you wouldn't need to drag the fixture off of your tank if you wanted to re-program it. (I walk with crutches and can't carry big stuff so I really appreciate things that are small enough to go in a pocket or small bag.)

Great thinking Carmie! I agree that would be alot easier

I like this idea... now to figure out the implementation!

-Chris
AI - KD

This is a cool discussion.

Chris, i agree, the ethernet connection belongs with the controller more than with the light. but i would say that the controller should be able to collect data from a and configure the light fully if a person were to buy it. it would override the internal panel from that aspect, but the internal panel could still be used..

as far as having the mini panel for basic config, i think that would be fine as long as its a multi-line LCD or something.. just thinking of there interface, would not the words and options to be scrolling or hard to read because the screen is too small. i understand some will, but just wanted to through that out there,

Hi Rob:

The light would have a connector on it allowing the user to connect it to our controller we plan to release in the future.

The internal panel would still be available to control the light fixture if desired.

Our current prototypes are using a 16x2 character LCD, which seems to be a nice size and comfortably allow everything to fit.

I should have some renderings/pictures of the new design later this week.

-Chris
AI - KD

Chris, i agree, the ethernet connection belongs with the controller more than with the light. but i would say that the controller should be able to collect data from a and configure the light fully if a person were to buy it. it would override the internal panel from that aspect, but the internal panel could still be used..

as far as having the mini panel for basic config, i think that would be fine as long as its a multi-line LCD or something.. just thinking of there interface, would not the words and options to be scrolling or hard to read because the screen is too small. i understand some will, but just wanted to through that out there,

Hi All:

I apologize for not having anything new and exciting to post at the moment. I'm not a big fan of a thread gaining moment, then going stale.

A week ago, we sent a prototype unit off to Dana Riddle for his evaluation. As you know, he has a tremendous amount of experience and knowledge in this area.

We hope to have some initial test data back in the next week. Until then, our posts (unless questions/comments arise) will probably be a bit stagnant.

Thanks for all the supportive input so far; this was the response we had hoped for.

Best regards,
-Chris
AI - KD

thanks for the update Chris..
hope to hear the results soon.. :)

Hi guys,

All this talk of USB/Ethernet/serial port is very interesting but I just thought I would throw something into the mix as it doesn't seam to have been brought up. These lights are sitting on top of a tank of warm salt water, any evaporation can possibly find it's way into an open socket and will corrode the connection. Then the owner will have a partially functioning light sitting on top of the tank after a few yrs as opposed to something lasting 10 yrs +.

Something to mull over

Christopher

Reef Boy I was just reading over this thread and had the same thought.

Well my idea for what it is worth (probably not a lot as this thread seams to be little old) is to use an optical connector like you find on home stereos.
This could be plugged in to a small usb device and programmed on your pc (or disconnected and programmed then would update light when plugged back in).
This usb device could then be replaced with the new controller that has Ethernet access.

Hi Guys:

Good observations and potential solutions.

If we did put a port on the fixture, we'd supply a cover of some sort for when a cable is not connected to prevent corrosion of the contacts.

I like the optical idea; that's an interesting concept. It'd require a specific protocol to be written, but a good idea.

We are currently designing the fixture to have a character LCD built into the end cap with a 'headphone' jack for future expandability. The fixture is designed to be set and forgotten.

On another note, testing has been going well. We've identified some areas we need to work on, but our PAR output is about 2.25x the other LED fixture(s) and around 1.5x a 250W MH (>1400 microMole photons per square meter per second).

We are working on our color spectrum to increase PUR.

I'll keep you updated.

-Chris
AI - KD

Hi All:

Testing with Dana has gone well; he has been great to work with and an invaluable resource.

We are working on a few array changes; we could start production now, but we want to make sure it is 'the best' it can be.

As I said in my previous post we found the PAR values to be a good deal higher than a 250W MH (>1400 microMole photons per square meter per second) which is pretty impressive. Our changes may reduce this some, but the overall effective area will be increased.

We changed our minds on the control placement again. The fixture will come with a small external controller, that is pretty much a display and buttons to control it. It's a low cost solution (to please those who don't want a bunch of fancy control) but will have seamless connection to our future controller.

We will be releasing pricing after the array change is complete and tested, and then will go into production. The production cycle is estimated at 4-6 weeks; it's very dependent on the LED lead time.

We'll also have a special offer for our early adopter customers. Details will follow with pricing.

Thanks again all for your support!

-Chris
AI - KD

Great! Can't wait to see more of the LED lights available. Being able to mount it inside a hood will be a big plus for me.

Greetings all:

It's been a couple weeks since I updated the forum; wanted to take a moment to do so.

Testing has been on going, on both our side and Dana's. We're waiting for a few components to arrive so we can complete the build and proceed with rigorous testing. This should be by the end of next week.

As of now, our lead time looks to be about 6-8 weeks for our first build, then 4-6 weeks (if not less) moving forward. Many components required one-time tooling/engineering, which adds to our first build time.

Our target first shipment is the end of June/early July. It may be sooner, but is very dependent on the initial production.

We will be accepting pre-orders in the next couple weeks, and offering a discounted price for our 'early adopters' as I said in my last post.

Pricing isn't finalized, but I'd like to know what you guys think. You know how much the competition is and what the alternatives cost. Do you think that the current price range of a LED fixture is acceptable considering the early stages of the technology, or does it need to be less to be competitive over the traditional solutions?

I am very interested in your thoughts regarding this.

Please voice your opinion on all of this; we haven't gone to production yet. If there's something that you all see as a necessary change/option, please let us know.

Thank you for your continued support.

Best regards,
-Chris Clough
AI - KD

I think that about half the price of current systems would compare to other high end lighting options. But with no bulb replacement and lower energy costs it becomes a no-brainer. Unfortunately I will probably get my tank setup a month or two too soon for your first shipment. Otherwise I would be very anxious to see your prices and make my decision. Although I may wait to see before I order lights.

I've been saving for an LED fixture. While I appreciate the long term cost savings it is tough to drop that much at once. I am also in a situation where I am currently using PC's. I may save on heat production/using my chiller but I will not have a reduction in my electric bill just on the basis of an LED fixture VS. the PC's I am using now. So, it is not even like I can say that I will save so many dollars a month and after however many months the fixture will have paid for itself. I think a lot of people looking to upgrade may be in the same situation making it even harder to spend the money.

Greetings all:

Wanted to let those that weren't updated via our mailing list that we've posted pricing on our website.

As I said in previous posts, we'll be offering an Early Adopter discount - it's shown on the 'Order (http://www.aquaillumination.com/order.html)' section of our website.

We are also in the process of putting more data up, and hopefully pictures of the production unit in the next few weeks (once the initial parts have arrived).

Please let me know if you are interested or have any quesitons.

Best regards,
-Chris
AI - KD

Hi Chris,

I checked out the website and there needs to be a serious update to the features page. Basicly there is no information on what can be programed into the light, what light intensity, what the equivalent MH light is, ratio of blue and white LEDs etc.

people need this info to make an informed decission.

Christopher

I don't know why I didn't notice this before, but I was looking over your webpage today at the specifications. Your white LEDs have the equivalent kelvin temperature of 6500. Are you planning on coming out with a 20,000K equivalent system? Any idea at what nm spectra the majority of your light is falling into?

Hi there:

The spec is of the white LED itself. It's the combination of white and blue that create the higher color temperatures.

It can range from ~6,500K to 25,000K plus - it's dependent on the intensity of the two LEDs.

We'll have a spectral plot of the fixture on our website this week - I'll link it once it's up.

-Chris
AI - KD


I don't know why I didn't notice this before, but I was looking over your webpage today at the specifications. Your white LEDs have the equivalent kelvin temperature of 6500. Are you planning on coming out with a 20,000K equivalent system? Any idea at what nm spectra the majority of your light is falling into?

okay...cool....thanks!

Hi All:

If you check out our website @ AquaIllumination | Aquatic LED Illumination (http://www.aquaillumination.com/) you'll see we've added quite a bit.

We're constantly adding more info/data, so check back frequently.

If you have any quesitons, please let me know via email or this thread.

Best regards,
-Chris
AI - KD

While the vast majority of this conversation is far beyond me i have been following this with great interest! First, i really dig your inclusion of the reefing community in the product development Chris. Not only is that courteous but i think it makes good business sense.

Also, going back to the whole networked idea of the unit: would this have a web-page like an HP printer? With our printers at work they have a static IP (i think) you can bookmark on your browser. The page has all sorts of information and options for changing settings and such. Is that the sort of thing you all were talking about earlier?

I am a huge fan of wireless communication, whether it be Bluetooth or wi-fi. My fish have been dieing to get on the internet :)

As an amateur statistician (if there is such a thing) i love getting all the data i possibly can. Is there a way to have the data come into the computer as a tab or comma delimited text file? Or, maybe have an export function on the software? That format can be imported by just about any program, from Excel to SPSS and SAS. Then we could so some serious nerdy number-crunching!!

Sorry, just thought of another comment.

When you were talking about various sensors, would it be possible to add "holes" (like USB, or some other jack) to add more? I would think that would give you, the company, flexibility by allowing people to buy the sensors separately and allowing future development of more sensors we could just plug into to the lighting system.

Hey Chris any news on the release date yet?????????

Starting to get a little impatient, it is like a when I was a kid waiting for christmas:santacrazy:


Christopher

Hi Christopher,

We're supposed to have the first articles here at the end of this coming week... the following week the majority is supposed to arrive.

...still planning on shipping at the end of July; I'm hoping to get some 'real' pictures out to those on the mailing list.

I'll let you know if things deviate from plan.

Best regards,
-Chris

OK. I should have no finger nails by then but at least I'll have a good looking tank!!!!!!

Christopher

lol i wish i had the money for this ligths for my new monster but i can't

lol

is any one looking to sponser me lol with half of the price

here is a sweet idea ... a LED RETRO kit !! this anything you guys might be interested in looking into ?? it would make this lighting option a lot more affordable to some of us.

Might be nice but the exterior packaging probably isnt a significant part of the cost. So it might be better to have it all properly sealed up to keep any moisture out. Also I think they said they would fit into standard hood sizes with the vents on top so it could be suspended in a canopy and still get proper ventilation.

Has anyone ever gotten any mail from the mailing list? I've subscribed with two email accounts and haven't gotten anything on either address.

Very interested in some updated news as I'm waiting for my lights to arrive :)

I emailed Chris a few weeks ago and he replied that he is expecting it to ship at the end of this month. I am in the same position as you so I am keeping my fingers crossed that everything is on track.

Christopher

Hi Gobie and :welcome: to TR.

Its funny, the day after I ask about it, they send something out.

Sounds like they are delayed a bit longer :(

New pictures available on the web site (http://www.aquaillumination.com/gallery.html).

Hi All,

I apologize for not responding to the forum more promptly. For some reason I wasn't receiving emails notifying me of new posts.

As of today, we have been told the parts should be sent to us in 2-3 weeks, so we're sitting at the end of the month for shipping to our customers.

I apologize for this delay; we want to provide you the highest quality product.

Thank you for your patience and business.

Best regards,
-Chris Clough

So things are ready to go other than this part?

Yes, everything else is ready to go.

I'll keep you all posted.

BR,
-Chris

So things are ready to go other than this part?

I hope this "part" isn't just a pretty box :)

I wish it was that simple.

-Chris

I hope this "part" isn't just a pretty box :)

Any new news? :p

ok chris, just a few more questions, i might have found this in the nick of time lol im ready to buy a new light fixture, and almost bought the 36 inch h4 solaris 20k 400watt fixture, honestly is your fixture just as good as it? does it have the lunar cycle option like the h4 does? is it at the same standards or more i saw you wrote that it is capable of up to 25k, is that good for corals? also, the h4 says it can penetrate about 29 inches deep, can yours do the same? do you reccomend your product for a half circle tank? thats the problem im having, pfo says the tank might have dark spots because led lighting shoot straight down and dont reflect like mh or t5ho lights. just curious i want the better of the 2 lights honestly, but i light what im hearing so far about your how its capable of upgrading and bluetooth etc etc. please let me know that info thanks.

I can't answer the Aqua Illumination questions but I can tell you the my 24" Solaris "G" does not leave dark spots in my 54 gallon bow front corner tank.

well thats good news for my reef tank i guess, especially since i wanted to get the H4, but honestly is it too soon to see which is better the H4 or the AQUAILLUMINATION fixture? what are the main differences between it and the H4 ? price is not an option to me, its quality, i want the best out there for my reef/fish tank.

I don't know how they compare to be honest. I LOVE my Solaris. I read today the first AI units are supposed to ship next week and that run is sold out. I think the prices are about the same.

They sent out their late summer update email and said that the lights should be shipping next week to those who preordered.

There are also some nice new pictures up on their site.

I noticed that PFO is putting out an 'I' series of lights as well as something called Galileo. Gotta find some more info on those.

well i called pfo and they told me the galileo series oare not led they are flouresents but i see ads that say galileo led lighting system so im not sure what to believe, i also heard they are led but not as nice as they h4, they will have just a simple turn on and off switch, they are not going to have a control on it or atleast not like that of the H4 OR AI. but the i series i dont know much about, i even called pfo and they couldnt find any info out for me either lol. im still very tempted on buying either the AI or H4. i wish i had head to head comparrisons.... i guess i will have to wait to see what dana riddle is going to say about the AI, hopefully he gives his true gut feeling of which is definitly better. cant wait to read it.

Anyone get any shipping info from AI yet? I've been checking all week and they haven't shipped to me or charged my CC yet. Anyone else?

Anyone get any shipping info from AI yet? I've been checking all week and they have shipped to me or charged my CC yet. Anyone else?

Hi Gobie,

Were you meaning to write they "haven't" charged your CC or shipped anything yet. If so, that would be consistant with my experience. No news yet.

Starting to get a bit frustrated by the lack of communication. They set a deadline, not hit it, then after a very pregnant pause we get some more info. Come on guys, let us know what is happening.

Christopher

I noticed that PFO is putting out an 'I' series of lights as well as something called Galileo. Gotta find some more info on those.

PFO's next shipment is due to ship at the end of October. The Solaris light are on the upgrade fast track. This shipment will be the newest version, the I series. The I series is 30% brighter than the H4 400W equivalent. The new Solaris will be brighter than the AI fixture. These units will sell out in just a couple of weeks. I have already sold a few, before PFO made the announcement (insiders privilege :up:) Here's a link to my thread announcing the latest version. http://www.talkingreef.com/forums/newthread.php?do=postthread&f=34

well i called pfo and they told me the galileo series oare not led they are flouresents but i see ads that say galileo led lighting system so im not sure what to believe, i also heard they are led but not as nice as they h4, they will have just a simple turn on and off switchHere's a bit on info on the Galileo for you. It is LED, it is without a controller, it has day whites, day blues and a moonlight, it's on or off. The Galileo will be about 1/2 price of the full blown Solaris. You can find more information at the link above.

Hi Gobie,

Were you meaning to write they "haven't" charged your CC or shipped anything yet. If so, that would be consistant with my experience. No news yet.

Starting to get a bit frustrated by the lack of communication. They set a deadline, not hit it, then after a very pregnant pause we get some more info. Come on guys, let us know what is happening.

Christopher

When you get frustrated like that, it makes you wonder what their customer service will be, doesn't it? They are a new company and for the kind of money LED fixtures cost I would prefer a track record. They have yet to ship one unit, according to this thread. Their track record so far is to not promptly keep everyone informed of the status of the lights. That doesn't sound good.

PFO has been reliable (delivering LED lights for a year), professional and very responsive to customers concerns. PM me for further discussion.

ReefBoy & Gobie:

We started shipping last week - the rest will follow this weekend and next. For the larger fixtures, (60" & 72") we found an issue we wanted to resolve prior to shipping. We're back on track, and they're in testing.

I can understand your frustration, and we greatly appreciate your patience; rest assured, the wait will be worth it. Unlike other companies, we don't ship a product until we are confident that there won't be problems in the field (ie: power supplies, wiring, cosmetics, etc.)

I was unaware that there was messages on this board, and I apologize for my lack of communication on this thread. The best way to communicate with us, is via email.

We sent an update out to our mailing list a week ago Friday, to let our customers know the status. Please let me know if you didn't receive it.

Again, we appreciate your patience and will forward a tracking number to you shortly.


Amphibious

Making claims that the new PFO I4 light is more powerful than ours is a bold. Unless PFO has copied our design - array arrangement, drive electronics, and LEDs then this is a totally untrue statement. Rather, there's presently no back-up to this.

I would love for a third-party to compare ours to the H4 or I4. Next month, Dana Riddle's review in Advanced Aquarist will show how we really compare to the alternative.

As for our customer service, we respond to > 90% of received emails in 12 hours. As of late, it's been a bit slower with production. In general, we provide responses quickly.

Is good customer service defined by sending out a product that has flaws, then fixing problems (that should have been addressed in the first place) in a fairly expedient manner?

I guess our philosophy is different; if QA issues are found prior to shipment, hold it back! A delay in shipment is better than the frustration felt by the customer for a faulty product.

Regards,
-Chris Clough

Making claims that the new PFO I4 light is more powerful than ours is a bold. Unless PFO has copied our design - array arrangement, drive electronics, and LEDs then this is a totally untrue statement. Rather, there's presently no back-up to this.
As far as making an untrue statement, I'm simply repeating what Pat told me. Pat doesn't copy anyone else's design. He's intelligent enough to come up with his own design. Right now everyone thinks PFO is simply pushing the H series LED to produce more light. That's not true. I am not at liberty to explain at this time.

I would love for a third-party to compare ours to the H4 or I4. Next month, Dana Riddle's review in Advanced Aquarist will show how we really compare to the alternative.
The only comparison that would matter is a comparison between the Aquaillumination and the I series. No one has made a claim that the H series is brighter than the AI, that I know of. I'm sure Dana would love to do a comparison between the two.

As for our customer service, we respond to > 90% of received emails in 12 hours. As of late, it's been a bit slower with production. In general, we provide responses quickly.
That's good but, not what was being reported here on this thread.

Is good customer service defined by sending out a product that has flaws, then fixing problems (that should have been addressed in the first place) in a fairly expedient manner?
Pat didn't know the original units were going to be flawed. If he even thought of it I'm sure he would have done in house testing as he does now. On the positive side, I believe 100% of the issues of the original series have been taken care of to the satisfaction of the customer. I know my customers have been taken care of. If there are any customers that have an issue they can contact PFO direct at 800 577-9690 ext 17 or PM me I'll see to it any issue, that isn't frivolous, will be taken care of.
I guess our philosophy is different; if QA issues are found prior to shipment, hold it back! A delay in shipment is better than the frustration felt by the customer for a faulty product.
Time will tell on that one Chris.

You know Chris, I requested to be put on AI's retailer information list. As an E-retailer I can sell any manufacturers product that I trust. I got one e-mail from AI that said someone would get back to me. Since that response, nothing. I'm not married to PFO. I sell the Solaris because, besides loving it myself, it's the only LED on the market till now. At least, apparently. I'm waiting to hear from AI on that one.

Dick

Chris thank you for jumping in to update...

NOW... before this gets into a "us vs. them", "this vs. that" debate, lets keep in mind that this thread IS to announce and discuss the new product coming from AI. it is not in the wild yet and test results have not been published.
Based on that, any direct comparison should not be placed in this thread unless its based on published technology comparisons.

I am all for comparing general technologies, and yes, PFO and AI are going to be competing companies and im sure both will love and hate the competition in some ways. I just want to make sure that our community treats all with the respect they deserve.

Im sure Amphibious is simply making comments on a product he has used, and trusts. After reviewing the thread (using search terms) i do not see a where anyone claimed they are more powerful, so lets put that to rest. no one in the general public can make that claim right now, so lets not try.

The one open issue is regarding communication. I see communication as the number one most important factor when rating a companies customer service. If a product is good, bad, or if there are shipping problems, delayed, breakage, etc, I can accept all of this if its properly communicated. Its important to understand that simply posting in this thread may not be enough to qualify as "contacting the company". An email to the company directly or a PM would be more appropriate IMO. That said, i do feel that if AI new of shipping delays they should proactively communicated this, or notified customers in advance of how to get updated details (ie. a mailing list, etc) Since i am not directly involved i can not say AI has or has not properly done this, but this may be a valid discussion point.

All said, lets get back on track here.. lets continue with the respect that people come to expect from the Talkingreef community. if you have a problem with a vendor or a member please attempt to take it up and get resolution in private and lets not turn a potential minor issue into a public disaster or a bad word of mouth for any company or vendor.

Rob,

Thanks for your comments. Chris and I have e-mailed back and forth since this aired. I believe he and I are OK with things.

Dick

Hmm, I'm not getting emails saying there are new posts in this thread even tho I subscribed.

You were right reefboy I meant to say haven't and corrected it in my post.

And now that I've read Chris' comment about issues with the 60" and 72" units, I know why they haven't charged my CC or sent any shipping information. I guess that means more waiting. I'm glad I resisted the temptation to buy an light loving animals at macna.

:cry:

Hey Gobie, I wish I would have known you were at MACNA. A bunch of us TR folks got to meet each other in person and it would have been nice to have you join us.

That would have been fun CarmieJo. I had hoped that AI would be there, but sadly they were not :(

That would have been fun CarmieJo. I had hoped that AI would be there, but sadly they were not :(
yes, i too was hoping they would be there..

hopefully they will join us next year for MACNA XX (http://www.macnaxx.com) in Atlanta

I heard that they weren't there because they were getting ready to ship lights.

would love peoples thoughts on this new announcement.

http://www.talkingreef.com/forums/lighting/5066-new-brighter-leds.html#post59491

420 Lumens in 8 Watts, so ~50 lumens/watt, isn't that just kinda average

Hmm, I'm not getting emails saying there are new posts in this thread even tho I subscribed.

Gobie-

Perhaps you haven't visited the thread since you got your last notification?

Just an idea...

-S

420 Lumens in 8 Watts, so ~50 lumens/watt, isn't that just kinda average
i am FAR from an LED expert, but the article stated its previous gen LED was about 200 lumens, so i saw it as a significant improvement, but hey, what do i know...lol

Hi Guys,

Just an update, I have had my CC charged for the 48" light and been emailed a tracking number. As I am in Australia it may take a little while to get here, but as soon as it does, I'll post pics and give a review on the ease of use. It will take some time to see how the corals respond.

Christopher

I will look forward to hearing of your experience. With my Solaris I could actually see a difference in my corals within a couple weeks. http://www.talkingreef.com/forums/53191-post178.html and http://www.talkingreef.com/forums/53195-post179.html Now the difference is amazing! Everything is thriving and they have never looked better.

went on the solaris forum and saw these #s between the i4 and the ai. here is the link
Solaris Aquarium LED Lighting Forum (http://solarisled.com/Forum/tabid/53/forumid/8/threadid/186/scope/posts/Default.aspx)

im gonna order the i4, hopefully i get the order in before they are sold out.

Good to hear that Reefboy, I still haven't heard anything about mine, but the 72" units did have a delay.

tlpmyd, you sure a vendor is going to give you unbiased numbers? Probably wouldn't hurt to wait for Dana Riddles article. At Macna he did say the you can provide too much light after which you're just wasting money and electricity, although I'm sure some people will never believe that. He did say, and I quote, "LEDs rock". I'm looking forward to his article.

well the artilce mr. riddle will right is on the ai, and im sure he will praise the light, the light is a great light im not doubting that, but the new i4 does outperform it just like the ai use to outperform the h4 but now solaris does not sell the h4's anymore they just upgraded to the i4. if the i4 was not around i would go with the ai, but now solaris came back with a quick answer the i4.

tlpmyd-

It is interesting that the host at the Solaris forum mentions "patent infrigement issues (http://www.solarisled.com/Forum/tabid/53/forumid/8/threadid/186/scope/posts/Default.aspx)" that AI may have to address.

I heard Dana's talk too. One thing is certain, he is in favor of LED lights and uses them himself. The beauty of the LED's is that they are easily controlled. So, if you have the stronger LED's and don't need them, you can back them down.

BTW tlpmyd, I may have said this somewhere else in this thread but you might want to check The Cultured Reef (http://www.theculturedreef.com/) for their pricing. It is where I got my Solaris and I found that they had the best prices around.

well the artilce mr. riddle will right is on the ai, and im sure he will praise the light, the light is a great light im not doubting that, but the new i4 does outperform it just like the ai use to outperform the h4 but now solaris does not sell the h4's anymore they just upgraded to the i4. if the i4 was not around i would go with the ai, but now solaris came back with a quick answer the i4.

I'm sure AI has a great light, that's why I'm asking to become a dealer. However, I don't know how you can say the AI outperforms the H4 since no comparative study has been done, to my knowledge. If you know of a study, please direct us to it so we can read it, too.

And, just for everyone's knowledge, PFO didn't bring out the I4 series as a quick answer to the AI. PFO is on a constant research and development plan because the LED industry is in it's infancy. I'm sure, if we were privy to PFO's inside track, we'd be amazed at what's on the drawing board.

I would also suspect that AI is not sitting on it's haunchs figuring the AI first light is the last they will design and produce.

BTW tlpmyd, I may have said this somewhere else in this thread but you might want to check The Cultured Reef (http://www.theculturedreef.com/) for their pricing. It is where I got my Solaris and I found that they had the best prices around.

I second that. Pleasure to deal with. Prompt replies via email as well...

-S

CarmieJo, rroselavy,

Thanks for the vote of confidence you guys. I do my best to provide good prices and clear communication with my customers. I really appreciate your recommendation.

Dick

well the only reason i said the ai was a better light than the h4 was become on pfo's forum their own host showed the #'s, ai had brighter white light by almost 2x of that of the h4, the blue lighting was the same. but now the i4 has the same amount of brightness in white lights as the ai but more than double the amount of blue. as far as being a quick answer i meant that as a good thing not as a quick fix or anything lol.

Got it. I understand now. I didn't see that.

And, just for everyone's knowledge, PFO didn't bring out the I4 series as a quick answer to the AI. PFO is on a constant research and development plan because the LED industry is in it's infancy. I'm sure, if we were privy to PFO's inside track, we'd be amazed at what's on the drawing board.

I would also suspect that AI is not sitting on it's haunchs figuring the AI first light is the last they will design and produce.

I'm sure we're all going to have to get used to this from every vendor that enters the market with LED lights. The technology is so new and advancing so rapidly, it reminds me of the CPU speed wars in the 90s. As soon as you buy something, its already obsolete :)

Isn't that the truth.

carm.jo thanks for that info, spoke to dick today from theulturereef and he's a really nice guy and your right his prices are just as nice, im placing my order today for the new i4 and cant wait to get it.

Solaris leg height posts move to new thread

lets try to keep the discussion here related specifically to the Aquaillumination, or directly related comparisons.
thanks for your co-operation.

Actually, we run ours at 1A which provides 240 lumens on the white and on the blue 750mA for 38.5 lumens.

Those are of course straight from the spec sheet, not accounting for temperature swings, but spec to spec we have higher output.

...I actually had a very long reply to this... but somehow managed to loose it when trying to post.... I'll type it again and post it another day.

BR,
-Chris

well the only reason i said the ai was a better light than the h4 was become on pfo's forum their own host showed the #'s, ai had brighter white light by almost 2x of that of the h4, the blue lighting was the same. but now the i4 has the same amount of brightness in white lights as the ai but more than double the amount of blue. as far as being a quick answer i meant that as a good thing not as a quick fix or anything lol.

so basically your saying your whites and blues are still brighter than the i4?

That is correct.

-Chris

so basically your saying your whites and blues are still brighter than the i4?

Hey guys, just to let you know I got my light installed today. Looks great, will post pics and review soon.

Christopher

That's good to hear Reefboy. The large units are delayed again, but I'm anxious to hear what you think of yours.

Hey guys, just to let you know I got my light installed today. Looks great, will post pics and review soon.

Christopher

Pics pics pics, pics pics pickety pics pics pics pics!!!! :crazy:

I am eager to see a FTS with this new light, and your initial thoughts...

-Scott

Greetings all:

The Advanced Aquarist Product Review by Dana Riddle is in this month's issue:
Advanced Aquarist's Online Magazine - Product Review: Aqua llumination's LED Lighting System: An 88-watt Sun for Your Reef Tank (http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2007/10/review)

Best regards,
-Chris

Hi Guys,

Sorry on 2 fronts, not getting back sooner and no photos yet. I have been getting ready for a 1 mth OS trip, so things are getting hectic.

Anyway, the light is good........ Very good................. Actually, brilliant.:D

Big thing I can say is it is very different to M/H lighting(Arcaida 250W pendant suspended from the ceiling). The M/H light reflects light all over the place in the tank, and out of it. At night when the tank was on we didn't need any other lights on in the living room as there was so much reflected light bouncing around the room(enough to read by!!!!!!!). The contrast to the LED's is that they are a downward directed light, so it highlights shadows dramatically and this does take a bit of getting used to(in my case, a couple of hours). Also I feel in my case the light needs to be higher up from the water surface to get the spread of light to hit the front of the tank. But I will organize this when I get back from holiday. The quality of light is very different, it looks more brilliant then the M/H without the eye squinting factor. This may also have something to do with the increased contrasts of light and shadow, but it does look very natural. Also it still has the shimmer effect of the M/H which I like, but it is not as profound. The night light is also a great feature, but the again I have never had one. Another aspect of the unit is the way the light just fades up and down(you can set this time period up to 1 hour). I no longer have my fish getting startled when the M/H switch on(not so bad) or off(very bad).

One of the other things that I feel is the most important feature is the heat transfer into the tank. Under the M/H I would have an easy 3C/6F temperature swings from having the M/H lights on. Also on hotter days where the room temp reach over 26C/79F, the chiller would be kicking in because the tank temp would hit 28C/82F. This would in turn increase the temp in the room and heat the tank more. Generally I would find on days where the outside temp hit 29C/84F the chiller would be kicking in after the M/H were running for 4 hours. Now here is the really interesting thing, yesterday the outside temp hit 31C/88F and the tank temp only had a 1C/2F swing. At this rate, I may be able to get rid of my chiller, and cool the tank with a fan occasionally during summer. This is going to be a great long term power saver, not to mention helping to reduce the greenhouse emissions.:mrgreen:

The controller is very easy to set up and use. You could really say it is idiot proof. You twist the knob to shift to a selection and press it to make enter the selection. The same is also true for changing a setting, twist to go up or down and press to enter. The menu structure is very simple and easy to follow.

Now the criticisms of the unit.

The first on is the feet that are supplied with the unit are not very stable. They will hold the unit in place with no problem but the feet do not like any sort of horizontal pressure. So you need to be careful in moving the unit once it is in place as it feels like it will collapse. I have mentioned this to Chris and he has assured me that they are aware of this issue and are have more stable legs being made as we speak and will send them out once they are ready. This is great as I get to enjoy my light while waiting for the legs.:D

The other issue is the length of cables which are attached to the transformers. The cable between the transformer and the light is only approximately 3ft long which makes it very hard to find a good place for the transformer(away from water). Ideally I think the cable should be between 9-12ft. This might seam long but if you are going to use the light as a pendant, then you are going to need the extra length to secure the cable so it doesn't twist the fitting in it's hanging position. This length also gives you options on where to place the transformer, I personally wouldn't feel comfortable locating the transformers in a tank hood with the moisture build up that would occur. Chris has also assured me they are looking at a fix for the cable lengths as well.

As you can see the criticisms are fairly minor. The light unit is really awesome!!!!!! For anyone contemplating this unit, I highly recommend it. There is not even a hint of buyers remorse in this purchase.:D:D

I am going to enjoy my tank now.

Christopher

PS I will try to post some pics before I leave:fingers: I'll do my best. Also as far as the coral goes, the softies responded well within hours but the acro will take longer to show. I will update when I get back also.

Great! Keep us posted.

can someone tell me the measurements of the wire for the i4 or h4 im guessings they are the same lengths? what i need is from the fixture to the ballast and then the ballast to the plug. thanks

Just adding to the software discussion, if this evolves into true open-source it needs to be able to run on Linux OS as well. More often Linux users know programming language, (im still learning command line) and can customize their options a little more. Besides that, Linux like Mac, on a constant information flow and on all day will be able to save more power than windows operations. That should be important. To keep power and data usage on the computer low as well.

can someone tell me the measurements of the wire for the i4 or h4 im guessings they are the same lengths? what i need is from the fixture to the ballast and then the ballast to the plug. thanks

Amphibious can probably chime in here, but this pfolighting page (http://www.solarisled.com/Specifications/I4Specifications/tabid/77/Default.aspx) indicates that the cable from the i4 fixture to the ballast is 8'. The removable plug cord length is not mentioned, but I believe it is a standard 6' cord like the ones used for computers.

those #'s work for me, thanks for the quick reply. cant wait to get this light!

Amphibious can probably chime in here, but this pfolighting page (http://www.solarisled.com/Specifications/I4Specifications/tabid/77/Default.aspx) indicates that the cable from the i4 fixture to the ballast is 8'. The removable plug cord length is not mentioned, but I believe it is a standard 6' cord like the ones used for computers.
Right on both accounts regarding my G series.

I have my tracking number, supposed to arrive on Thursday! :)

Yippee! I am looking forward to seeing your light.

I am concerned that the heatsink fins on top of the Aquaillumination will act as a dust magnet and be impossible to keep clean - any thoughts?

Hello Steve,

I don't have an answer but I wanted to say :welcome: to TR.

thanks Carmiejo - I intend to buy one of these LED contraptions, but can't decide which one. I would like to compare the LED used in the Aqua Illumination with the LED used in the new Solaris-I series, but while we know the AI uses a SSC P4, I haven't figured out what PFO is using now.

Hi there:

The fins are wide enough that should you want to clean it, you can take a damp Q-tip and wipe them down.

Air is moving through it most of the time, so dust will be more evident intake of the fans.

If you have any other questions, please feel free to email me.

Best regards,
-Chris Clough

I am concerned that the heatsink fins on top of the Aquaillumination will act as a dust magnet and be impossible to keep clean - any thoughts?

How many here have the AI running now? I have seen some pics and alot of discussion on the Solaris brand but have yet to find much info on the AI and would be real curious to hear about some experiances with these lights....any one??

Hi Putter & :welcome: to TR. I know that AI just just recently shipped their first units and a couple TR people have received notice that their's is on the way but I am not sure that I have seen any feedback yet.

Thanks Carmiejo, will have to just hang out and wait, see what the reactions are.

Thanks Carmiejo, will have to just hang out and wait, see what the reactions are.

Go and read my thoughts on page 6


Christopher

Any pics yet reefboy? Thanks for pointing your post out again, they do sound good indeed, and cheaper, but the jury is still out, so to speak. Would LOVE to see some pics of yours in action if you find the time :)

Any pics yet reefboy? Thanks for pointing your post out again, they do sound good indeed, and cheaper, but the jury is still out, so to speak. Would LOVE to see some pics of yours in action if you find the time :)

No pics for a month, as I am away from home.

Christopher

I put a few pictures on my blog, Dave's Reefin Adventures (http://gobie74.blogspot.com/)

No review yet, still tweaking, but overall impression is very positive. Reefboys concerns are valid however, but being addressed by AI.

Well a month or so has passed by since the last post, any one else using the AI yet? I have my tank and now need to order the light, but still can not make up my mind on which one to get, the AI or the I4, lots of thoughts and discussion on the AI but not to sure how much has actualy made it to production, an update from AI would be nice to see, have the cords been made longer, are the legs more stable now? Reefboy, any more input from you? I know you sounded pretty happy with them to start with, have you seen good growth? Have you had any issues with the light since your first review of it on page 6? Sure do appreciate the feed back, I need to get a light ordered, got a tank sitting here that just seems naked with out lights.

An update from AI:

The legs have been revised, and are much stronger. We just received them on Friday.

The power supply's are being reworked to have longer cables; future orders will go out with longer cables.

Also - the fixture is now sold exclusively through ReefGeek (http://www.reefgeek.com/). If you have any questions, please let them know. I will continue to watch TR for technical questions.

Best regards,
-Chris


...lots of thoughts and discussion on the AI but not to sure how much has actualy made it to production, an update from AI would be nice to see, have the cords been made longer, are the legs more stable now?

Thanks Chris, I will contact ReefGeek with further questions.

This sounds like good response to customer feedback. :)

hey putter i was one of the first to recieve the solaris i4 and its awesome, the only set back i had with it so far was my day whites went out, but i contacted pfo and they sent me replacements free right away! so now i know they have great customer service. the led stripes were very easy to replace aswell. i have it set on the solar/lunar cycle and it looks awesome. the length of the power cords are plenty for me, and i even have a taller than usual tank. i did alot of research between the i4 and the ai before i bought the i4, since i only seen and used the i4 it wouldnt be fair to judge them myself, the only thing i can say is i found alot more helpful info on the i4 and all pfo products than ai. im sure you cant go wrong with either of them.

Check this out about the Solaris

Reefs.org Forums :: View topic - PFO Solaris lights are a complete rip off and junk!!! IMO (http://www.reefs.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=114657)

My cousin stopped by the last weekend and took some pictures ( he has a better camera than me and is a semi-pro photographer ), hopefully soon I'll have some pictures to share.

soon some pictures?

Hi Twan and :welcome: to TR.

Question

1) Are the LEDs end user replacable? (I'd hate to have to pay out this amount of money and have to buy whole new units in 5 years time)

Suggestion

1) Bright red LEDS for night time viewing critters

Hello lovespuds and :welcome: to TR.

I understand the Solaris LED's are plug and play but I have not had to change any of mine out so I can't tell you how easy it is.

I'm glad to see some competition in the market and can see where with the controller aspects of this, it would be great to have the ability to monitor other levels and ene have it integrated into a home automation program. How sweet would it be to log in from a laptop from the road, adjust your household lighting, AC, water levels, etc. You could even get a text or email to your mobile if temps rose above a certain level or if a water sensor detects if the levels fall below a certain point.

Chris, check out what the zWave alliance is doing at Z-WaveAlliance.org - Alliance -- Start (http://www.z-wavealliance.org/). Beyond remote cameras and light/power switches and outlets controlled remotely, Schlage locks even make door handles and locks you can control from any internet connection.

Now THAT would set you above anyone else in the market ;)