About Micro Algae Grow

[cristos]

I start for the first time a phytoplankton culture and I want to ask you if it is necessary to add micro algae grow continuously. I took from Florida Aqua Farm one disk with nanocloropsis and one bottle Micro Algae Grow and I start to culture it. Must I use continuously ( daily ) micro algae grow or not? :roll:


P.S. I download the podcast but the video StartingPhyto-TR-Ep71 does not work good. All the others videos are fine. It stops into the middle.

[Paintbug]

theres instructions on the bottle of Algae Grow for dosage. i use Rob's method in the pod cast. i add 8 ml of Algae Grow to 2 US gal of water. that makes up my culture water. i dont add any more Algae Grow to the water after that. when you fill the vessel use that water and there will be plenty of Micro Algae Grow in there. once you start the culture it takes about 7-8 days and it should be ready to split. once you split the culture, top off the culture with the culture water. that adds the Algae Grow as well.

if you are having problems with the videos, try downloading VLC Media Player. it works great for me.

[CarmieJo]

I have had the same problem with another video. I fixed it by deleting it and downloading it again.

[cristos]

Thanks for the quick replies :) . I add 1 ml of Micro Algae Grow for 1 litre but the bottle does not write if it is necessary to add continuously that dosage for ever. Now I add 1 ml every day ( since from 30/12/06 ). Unfortunately I don’t have the plankton manual that suggest to use the FAF.

As far the videos I will download the VLC Media Player. The only problem which I have is on that video only. Alls the others videos works fine.

[Rob]

nutrients do not need to be added daily, just follow whats outlined by Paintbug above and you will be fine...
hopefully you can get that video working with Paintbug and Carmie's advice :)
i cover this stuff in the follow 2 videos
http://www.talkingreef.com/forums/podcast-episodes/557-culturing-phyto-video-podcast-episode-39-a.html
http://www.talkingreef.com/forums/podcast-episodes/2262-starting-phyto-culture-podcast-episode-71-a.html

[cristos]

I download the VLC media player but it stops into the middle ( video StartingPhyto-TR-Ep71 ). I will try to download again the video file:roll: .

[CarmieJo]

That is what I would do.

[cristos]

I download 3 times that file and finally work:D . Today I will check it. Thanks again for your help.

[Rob]

well i do apologize for the problems with the file, hopefully thats all the problems you have.. :)

[cristos]

No problem. Thanks for the help

[JeffDubya]

If you don't feed your phyto, it WILL crash.

I don't follow Rob on this one, and I have had a few long discussions with Erik from Alga-Gen about this issue.

Just keep in mind that we all do things a bit differently. I am in no way dissing on Rob (cause he's the master) but I hope to illustrate why he is - in my opinion - wrong when it comes to making up culture water that contains fertilizer.

Let's just assume for the sake of argument that a one gallon vessel of phyto will consume one ml of fertilizer in a week. Let's also assume that you will split your culture weekly (which you will be doing if you run a 24-hour photoperiod.)

So we split the culture by half. We top off with Rob's culture medium. I believe at this point we have effectively UNDER fertilized our phyto. Why? If mixed to the proper ratio, his culture will have 1 ml per gallon. Ad 1/2 gallon, it's 1/2 ml. But if the phyto has already depleted it's food source, there is pretty much ZERO in the jar when you go to split, and then 1/2 when you are finished, when there should be 1.

Furthermore, if you only take 1/4 of your jar out, you now add .25 ml of fertilizer, and it will totally vary depending on how much you remove, every time.

I prefer to NOT fertilize my culture medium. I just have fresh saltwater that I top off with, and then fertilize the entire jar with the proper dosing. That way, I always know that the phyto is ready to go with the proper dose of food.

I fertilize with 1 ml per gallon on Sundays, and 1/2 ml every wednesday - two feedings weekly. Again, this is because I run a 24 hour photoperiod. This is the amount that Erik instructed me to use.

I do not harvest until right before it is time to feed again, no reason to get those extra phosphates into the tank. Once the Sunday F-2 fertilizer has gone in, no phyto can be harvested for one week.

Since using this method, I have not had one crash.

Rob's method works for him... my method works for me. Guess you need to figure out which one works best for you and stick with it. Good luck!

[Rob]

Jeff,
i think this is great discussion.. thanks.. :)
i like the idea of feeding the way you do, interesting method.

the only things i see with it is this:
1.) this is a tried and true method for Nanno, for other types it may vary (we never did define Nanno formally, but it was assumed for the videos)
2.) you make the assumption that a 1 gallon vessel of Nannochlopsis at a density of say 20 million cells per liter is going to consume 1 ml of fertilizer in a week.
If this is fact then your numbers are right, but i haven't seen any reports on this formally (if you have them please share i would love to read them)
your formula only hold if the value of food needed in a week is more than 1/2 ml and if you split once a week.

lets say that 1 gallon vessel only needs 1/2 ml per week, well every split you add that 1/2 ml back in.

i don't pretend to know how much they need, i really have clue...lmao
i just know that this si the most popular and successful method i have found for Nannochlopsis, i am finding Isocrysis to be different, but thats another discussion...lol

(Jeff, i think we have a mutual respect for each other, so please dont take this as anything more than friendly discussion/debate to further both of our knowledge)

[JeffDubya]

No offense taken, I'm the one who raised the question.

I don't really have any clue as to how much fertilizer the phyto I grow needs, other than what the guy who grew out the starter cultures told me. :) I'm on a need to know basis. I don't need to know why, just tell me how much and when. If it works, I don't care why.

Let's face it, the only way to be 100% sure as to how much fertilizer is being consumed, or how much needs to be dosed, is to chemically sample the batch and add medium based on that reading.

Until then, I am working from two premises:

(1) Better to overfeed than underfeed

(2) I would rather know with complete certainty that every time I split/start a culture, that I have at LEAST 100% of the needed fertilizer in the batch. I firmly believe this is the only way to do that.

And what the hell are you growing that nanno WEED for anymore? You should listen to this great podcast called talking reef, specifically the episode on copepods and the one with Erik from Alga-Gen... :D:D:D There's better stuff to be growing.

[Rob]

thats cool, yes, to overfeed or underfeed.. hmm
well keep in mind that you are doing Iso, and those requirements are different than Nanno.. which is what my podcast and the discussion here was on, so we should be careful there

as for why i have Nano, im still having problems getting the iso cultures to produce the densities i need for the rotifers and fry, so until then i will also have Nanno which is a tried and true method.. im just trying to use the iso to see if i get better results.. :)

[JeffDubya]

as for why i have Nano, im still having problems getting the iso cultures to produce the densities i need for the rotifers and fry, so until then i will also have Nanno which is a tried and true method.. im just trying to use the iso to see if i get better results.. :)

Wow... I'm making soup here. I could literally be splitting two times per week, harvesting 75% each time. Are you using the 24 hour photoperiod?

I am growing Tetraselmis and Isochrysis in one gallon jars, 2 gallons of each. Using the methods listed, I have literally NEVER crashed a culture.

I literally throw away half of what I make.

[JeffDubya]

Oh and no matter what... you're the guy who got me started. So whether or not I currently agree 100% with your methods, if it wasn't for you, I wouldn't *have* a technique.

[Rob]

lol.. cool, im happy you have a method, id makes me happy when peopel take what i have shown and modified it to suit there needs... :)

yes, i have been trying 24 hours lighting.
my cultures never crash, they just dont get dense, so i am now trying to increase feeding frequency to see if that helps, along with lowering the bubble rate

anyways i think were off topic here, so before we continue on, i want to make sure we nailed all the open questions that cristos had..

cristos, was there anything else we didn't full answer for you?

[cristos]

All my questions answered. Thanks again. I am finding very interesting that dialog.

I want also to ask and another thing but I don’t know if it is better to ask it here in that post or not:roll: . If not please I will appreciate if you remove it into the correct place. I want to ask if it is easy to create a fertilizer.

[JeffDubya]

I want to ask if it is easy to create a fertilizer.

Use something professionally manufactured for aquarium use. I personally like the F/2 media that I bought from AlgaGen, many people like Micro Algae Grow.

I believe *both* are available in powdered form, so that you can mix with your own RO/DI water. Aside from this, I wouldn't "create" your own.

And steer clear of miracle-gro FWIW

Never put anything in your phyto that you wouldn't put in your tank.

[cristos]

Ok I understand :)

[Rob]

i agree with JeffDubya,
i use only micro algae grow and the F/2 Lab grade nutrients from Algagen (a Talkingreef Sponsor)
so far i have had positive results for years with these products and they should be available worldwide.